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Are all repeaters required to have a courtesy tone?

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jeff48356

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Jun 23, 2013
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With few exceptions, nearly all repeaters have their own courtesy tone that sounds between sides of a conversation. Is this an FCC requirement?

Also, some repeaters have a robotic-sounding voice that identifies the repeater, like "This is KE8HR Repeater. 146.760 megahertz". What is that thing called? Most repeaters don't have them.
 

jeff48356 said:
With few exceptions, nearly all repeaters have their own courtesy tone that sounds between sides of a conversation. Is this an FCC requirement?
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No. It is a courtesy tone meant to let you know when the other party has unkeyed their mic because the repeater stays keyed up. It is provided as a "courtesy" to the users.

Also, some repeaters have a robotic-sounding voice that identifies the repeater, like "This is KE8HR Repeater. 146.760 megahertz". What is that thing called? Most repeaters don't have them.
Click to expand...

Actually increasing number of repeaters DO in fact use them. they are ID'ers or voice identifiers. It IS an FCC requirement to ID the repeater just like any other station. Some use CW but more and more are using a digital voice module. Some allow you to record your own voice for identifying.
 
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jeff48356 said:
Also, some repeaters have a robotic-sounding voice that identifies the repeater, like "This is KE8HR Repeater. 146.760 megahertz". What is that thing called? Most repeaters don't have them.
Click to expand...

Most repeaters do that through their controller - it can be either a software or hardware controller. One of the most popular controllers that has this capability is made by Arcom: Arcom Controllers - RC210 PC Board
 
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It's also the point when the repeaters 'transmit time out' timer is reset if the repeater has one. If two parties are long-winded its a good idea to 'ring the bell' and reset the timer before the repeater enters a time-out on transmit. If it times out it will come back, but you will have to wait for the duration of whatever they have set.
Mike

Captain Kilowatt said:
No. It is a courtesy tone meant to let you know when the other party has unkeyed their mic because the repeater stays keyed up. It is provided as a "courtesy" to the users.

snip...
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A time out timer has nothing to do with a courtesy tone. A repeater has to drop out of tx and have no input signal to reset the TOT. Many long winded guys have had a repeater drop out while they were talking and it won't come nack up until they unkey to reset it. A courtesy tone can beep a hundred times and not reset the TOT.
 
One of the first Machines I helped set up was a old 100 watt GE forest service radio with a CAT 1000 controller with all the bells and whistles, we had Multiple courtesy tones, voice ID`s, all kinds of neat stuff....some of the Old Dinosaurs in the club bitched to no end about it, but I was chairman of the board and the repeater trustee LOL......radio is supposed to be F U N !


73
Jeff
 
Forgot to add that when someone wishes to reset a repeater TOT they usually announce it and then unkey and then wait until the repeater drops before keying back up again and continuing to talk.
 
Alot of people make mistakes by thinking once they here the courtesy tone that the reapeater has reset so there good and shouldnt time the repeater out but.......This isnt always so.

Our county repeater here doesnt reset until the repeater has fully unkeyed so they will time the damn thing out. I would every Sunday night when running our net let this be known incase of new operators joining in and also to remind the people that have been in the gropup because some would forget.

The same people would still long wind it and time the damn thing out so always keep this in mind when getting on a new repeater. Theres no need to be so quick on the key to begin with but certain people just dont get or grasp this fact.
 
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I stand corrected...

Back in my hole...


Captain Kilowatt said:
A time out timer has nothing to do with a courtesy tone. A repeater has to drop out of tx and have no input signal to reset the TOT. Many long winded guys have had a repeater drop out while they were talking and it won't come nack up until they unkey to reset it. A courtesy tone can beep a hundred times and not reset the TOT.
Click to expand...
 
Well.. our local repeater does work that way....as soon as the the courtesy tone sounds, the other operator can pick it up..otherwise it WILL time out.

Believe me I've done it many times...LOL
 
ahamoperator said:
Well.. our local repeater does work that way....as soon as the the courtesy tone sounds, the other operator can pick it up..otherwise it WILL time out.

Believe me I've done it many times...LOL
Click to expand...

We are talking two different things. A time out timer (TOT) is designed to prevent the transmitter from transmitting too long. It has to be reset by the transmitter actually stop transmitting. If it times out while there is still an input signal that input signal has to drop out before the TOT is reset enabling the transmitter again. A courtesy tone simply denotes when the other party has unkeyed. Courtesy tones are quite helpful when repeaters are linked.what you are saying is that as soon as one party unkeys and the tone sounds you can key up before the repeater drops. Most repeaters have a TOT set for about two minutes or so. It also prevents a jammer from locking the transmitter on steady and possibly burning out the repeater tx finals from overheating. That's the way any repeater I have ever used that had an actual TOT worked. Usually the TOT is disabled when linked or the autopatch is active but the courtesy tone still works.

BTW when I say TOT I am not referring to when the repeater simply drops out after the input signal drops which is what sounds lime you mean. I mean an actual tx inhibit controller.
 
some of the early controllers where setup to have them drop to reset there TOT. But now the newer controllers when you hear the tone Does reset there TOT. it is required to not go over 3 mintues of transmit time on the recieved input to the repeater. not on the output time of the repeater where it was actually timed before. Also newer controller do use voice ID however they also switch back to Morse code ID when the repeater receives a signal so the operater can be heard easier. It is by Law the Repeater ID every 10 min and 10 mintues after the end of the conversation. Most places put a /R to ID it as a repeater there are some area that do not require it check with your local repeater coordination council on this.
 
C.K. that was my fault I added to the courtesty tone question but also threw in the fact that not all repeaters reset when you hear the courtesy tone because our counties does not and has to completley unkey to reset which is why the other fella said their repeater resets at the courtesy tone ;)
 
The whole concept of a TOT is to prevent yransmitting too long. If the timet is reset simply by dropping the input carrier for a second and not having the output drop then there is no sense in it. I have a radio that has a builtin TOT. If I press and hold the ptt long enough the radio will switch back to receive even though the ptt is still pressed. I have to release the ptt switch to reset the TOT and press it again to continue transmitting. That is what a TRUE TOT functions like. It would never be reset simply by dropping an input carrier long enough to activate the courtesy tone. That would provide no protection for the transmitter at all if it could remain on if people kept keying as soon as the courtesy tone sounded.

Make that two radios. I forgot the HT has a TOT as well.
 
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time out timer

The point is that almost every repeater controller built in the last 25 years
operates as follows when a signal is received on the input the timer starts running if you continue to transmit long enough the timer expires and the transmitter stops txing. if the signal is removed before the timer expires the courtesy beep sounds and the timer resets and starts over again. if a signal expires the timer and stays on the input the transmitter will stay timed out not transmitting until the input signal goes away or un keys. in commercial world as a timeout timer is on the transmitter and runs its course timing how long the transmitter has been keyed regardless of the input signal it could be keyed from many other external sources most ham repeaters reset the timeout as the courtesy beep is sent . YMMV many variations on programming make for many possibilities

72+1 RCB
 

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