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Imax 2000 with ground plane kit VS Maco 5/8, what is your experience?

Lost Ram

426 in the North East Corner of the Texas Bayou
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Seen a thread today about NANO VNA testing an IMAX and almost posted there but decided to make a new one seeing it does not involve the NANO VNA. This is the post https://www.worldwidedx.com/threads/nanovna-first-scan-imax2000.270855/

I have both the Imax 2000 and a Maco 5/8. The Imax has a ground plane kit and a balun at the feed point (this is a must IMO). The Maco also has a balun at the feed point as well. These are both end fed antennas with a matching network. I can switch to either with my coax switches and switch in the same amp. I am NE Texas, when the propagation is good I have tested many times with them, both are at 26 feet to mast connection and both have LMR400 coax that are cut/tuned to be zero or close to it. They are 33 feet apart. Anyway, most far off location like the areas around New York and California say the Imax wins but its only just a tic on the meter and the audio is the same. Places closer to me say there is no difference as its a 50/50 split in options. When I work local there does not seem to be any notable difference either. When I do this test I just call them antenna A and antenna B so there is no bias and I dont disclose what the antennas are, I just say I put up a new one and need to compare. So take from that what you will but, the Imax needs a ground plane and both Imax and Maco should have a balun at the feed point as well IMO.

I have read and heard all the negative about the Imax and I am sure its true if its not setup right to get rid of the Common Mode and clean up the angle of radiation so you are not getting RF into unwanted areas under the antenna, this is where the ground plane kit helps, then you should really have some type of balun at the feed point to stop common mode. The ground plane kit does an OK job of this but the balun helps clean up the rest.

I have many wire antennas as well on the property to. All of them have roles that the others cannot fill, whether its band, polarized direction, and bandwidth. Normally my go to is my 572' Loop, it works on a few bands with really low SWR, 11M is one of them that is under 1.4 across the band and I use it often there to talk when the conditions are good. The internal tuner in the radio also tunes every band 160-6 meter, this took a bit tuning with wire length and 600 ohm feedline length but I got done. This antenna is my workhorse!!!

I find the Imax to be a useful antenna/tool when I need it. Its a great vertical for 15 meter with the tuner cleaning it up a bit when the 572 loop is just not cutting it with propagation across the equator.

I dont think the Imax or Maco are the end all be all antennas but they are both good tools to have when setup right. I have a DIY 1/4 wave for 11M that sometimes outperforms both the Imax and Maco depending on conditions and distance. I have a Tarheel screwdriver 160-10 setup 14 inches over my 32x24 steel roof that knocks it out of the park for overseas conditions, the roof is all bonded panel to panel with 1 inch braid along with the mount as well, then its got #6 going to four ground rods in the corners.

I am not trying to brag on the Imax being the best out there, I am just saying its a good tool if set up right with a ground plane and balun. I will also say that there has NEVER been a time when the Imax or the Maco out performed the other on any given conditions. In my setups of these two antennas I cannot say one works any better then the other when I have switched them out from one to the other.

When it comes down to it the Imax nor the Maco are my go to antennas for 11 meter when conditions are hot, my go to would be my 572' loop or my Maco VC-4 beam provided the conditions favor horizontal.

Anyway, please feel free to share your experience and be sure to note if your Imax had the ground plane kit as this really matters when comparting the two.
Please dont make this a post about bashing either antenna. I know some are going to post smith carts and all, I have a Rig Expert AA-650 zoom and looked at the two, they look vastly different for sure!!!!! By lookin at the smith chart the Imax should be a TURD!!!!

Also, I have lost the top section on 2 Imax antennas in hurricanes. Since I have replace the top sections with 102" steel whips this has not happened since. Every time a hurricane came through the Maco was down to make room for another antenna build going up due to the radials being in the way for deployment of wire and 600 ohm ladder line.

Let us see what you have experienced.
Kerry
 

Vertical endfed antenna compared to GP always lose.
Imax, Antron were explained, modelled and so on, there nothing more to add.
In Maco I would add more radials, since it is current fed antenna with maximum current at the bottom. It will improve it's performance.

Of course antenna should me insulated from mast, with choke baluns at the feedpoint and where coax enter the house. Buried coax would be perfect.
Mike
 
Vertical endfed antenna compared to GP always lose.
Imax, Antron were explained, modelled and so on, there nothing more to add.
In Maco I would add more radials, since it is current fed antenna with maximum current at the bottom. It will improve it's performance.

Of course antenna should me insulated from mast, with choke baluns at the feedpoint and where coax enter the house. Buried coax would be perfect.
Mike
I have the Maco isolated from the pipe with a 6 foot section of fiber glass mast that I robbed from my 2 meter quad build when I took it down. I have never tried that with the Imax, its mounted to a galvanized pipe. I have seen all the models on the Imax and such and even see it on my smith chart plot. I know it should be a complete TURD!!!!! I build all my own wire antennas and many for the local Hams. So I am familiar with the software and smith charts. Both perform neck and neck with each other no matter conditions. Locally when the conditions are bad I get more of a nod to the Maco by a slim margin but its not anything huge or even worth worrying about. I first heard about the mast isolation from W8JI's writings stating anything with ground radials should be isolated from the pipe. Anyhow, done that ever since with the Maco. I dont have two Maco's to compare this situation but, I cant say I seen a difference when I did isolate the Maco.
My Maco is down right now as I am working on putting my tower at that end of my shop for my Maco VQ4 beam. Perhaps when I get the Maco back up in the near future I can announce on this forum and we can do some tests with the folks here. Maybe we can catch some 10M conditions across the pond as well. I have all kinds of fun working with this antenna stuff. I really enjoy the wire antenna building with loops fed with 600 ohm feed line.
 
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This quote is from years ago when modeling the imax 2000 antenna and given a new piece of information...

Years ago when I studied various aspects of an a99 model I discovered that the GPK that Solarcon sells for said antenna actually outperforms the same model with 1/4 wavelength radials, if only slightly. This was a surprise to me. I also noticed that adding the mounting tube to the model helped the antennas gain as well. With the addition of the capacitor to my Imax models, I'm seeing again a design that shows more intelligence was involved in its creation than many give this company credit. If only they did something to deal with the common mode current problems their antennas have as well, although their GPK actually does a good job with that to...

That was from 10 years ago on this very forum... Unfortunately the models and such that I posted aren't there anymore... I will have to see if I still have them laying around somewhere...

And in another thread on this forum I actually talked about their GPK and compared it to four horizontal radials as well as other possible layouts and explained why it was actually better, but I can't seem to find that one.

I used to think the a99 and Imax were crap until I learned more about them... The people that designed them have shown a level of knowledge in the designs of these two antennas that almost no other company has shown, and I think its a shame that most of the people in the radio hobby can't see any of it...

Unfortunately, because of the wide bandwidth, people think they are dummy loads without actually understanding what is happening, and why and how such bandwidth was achieved... To be fair, the more recent versions from the last I don't know how many decades were fairly cheaply made, and the companies that bought the rights to these antennas didn't understand them and made profit decisions rather than quality decisions.

The Maco V58/V5000 is a great antenna to. Owned them all and worked with several examples of all of these antennas over time.

The Maco is a true 5/8 wavelength antenna, which will always have narrow bandwidths. The Imax is not, but another electrical length modified (and modified well) to fit in the space, and that is just a part of the reason why it has such a bandwidth.

Anyway, just my $.02 worth...


The DB
 
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This quote is from years ago when modeling the imax 2000 antenna and given a new piece of information...



That was from 10 years ago on this very forum... Unfortunately the models and such that I posted aren't there anymore... I will have to see if I still have them laying around somewhere...

And in another thread on this forum I actually talked about their GPK and compared it to four horizontal radials as well as other possible layouts and explained why it was actually better, but I can't seem to find that one.

I used to think the a99 and Imax were crap until I learned more about them... The people that designed them have shown a level of knowledge in the designs of these two antennas that almost no other company has shown, and I think its a shame that most of the people in the radio hobby can't see any of it...

Unfortunately, because of the wide bandwidth, people think they are dummy loads without actually understanding what is happening, and why and how such bandwidth was achieved... To be fair, the more recent versions from the last I don't know how many decades were fairly cheaply made, and the companies that bought the rights to these antennas didn't understand them and made profit decisions rather than quality decisions.

The Maco V58/V5000 is a great antenna to. Owned them all and worked with several examples of all of these antennas over time.

The Maco is a true 5/8 wavelength antenna, which will always have narrow bandwidths. The Imax is not, but another electrical length modified (and modified well) to fit in the space, and that is just a part of the reason why it has such a bandwidth.

Anyway, just my $.02 worth...


The DB
I agree with you. I have both and they work near identical as far as I can tell from reports I get. I also heard all the bad talk about them so I stayed away from the Imax, didnt get one until early 2006 when I ordered my Maco Shooting star from copper. Never ran one without a GPK. My brother got a second hand A99 for cheap back in the mid 90's, I told him they were junk as thats the info I had heard at the time. He had the bottom of it at about 45 feet, drove it with his Cherokee base station that was just stock. I was really amazed how well it worked for him. It was definitely not junk. He seemed to keep up with all the other base stations in the area with vertical antennas. Shortly after that he upgraded to a Galaxy mobile, the 200 watt rig, that was a game changer for him, he thought that was pretty Kewl stuff back then.
 
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The Imax benefits from isolating it from the conductive mast & choking the coax,
it effects performance and rfi in the shack depending on the mast length & if its grounded or not
& coax length & its path to ground/common mode impedance,

we have used fork/spade handles & fiberglass tube, radials & a choke to eliminate the issues people often complain about,

wrapping a piece of bike innertube or electrical tape around the mast is not rf isolating the antenna,

Imax get a bad rep because people bolt them to a conductive mast & don't bother with radials & an effective choke on the coax,

a few people get VERY lucky with lengths & don't have any issues,

If the manufacturer had given proper installation instructions (none of them ever do) they could have avoided most of the bad press & thrown them in the bin claims for both Imax & A99.
 
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How would you properly isolate the antenna from the mast?





Years ago I used a piece of solid 1.25 dia x 42" long fiberglass rod bolted on the top of mast and then the A-99 bolted on the fiberglass at the top.
It was stock for sprayer arms.
Choked it off below the connector with some coax,I never had any complaints about interference with it.
Never used the gpk.

73
Jeff
 
I use fiberglass tube that fits inside scaffold pole for smaller antennas or concentric fiberglass tubes epoxied together for heavier antennas,

Form my sigma4 hybrid & g-max the inner fiberglass tube fits up inside the antenna with a clamp that joins the 1-5/8 bottom sections to the outer fiberglass tube, the bottom end has a lathed out piece of scaffold pole epoxied & bolted on so I can clamp it with a normal scaffold sleeve joint,

we have had good results with wood or fiberglass fork/spade handles knocked into the pole for Imax 2000 & a99

We don't wrap anything round the conductive pole & overlap the pole/antenna mount to avoid any possible coupling @ RF frequencies but it way work if its thick enough.
 

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Liking all the relies here. All good info for those that did not do this with their vertical.
I use an isolation balun/choke/transformer (whatever your terminology is) on all my verticals. Never isolated my Imax from the mast, only the Maco has that. Perhaps I should give it a go for the Imax while the Maco is down. I stop the RFI/common mode so perhaps I wont see any difference but it will be good experiment. Has anyone seen it change the takeoff angle?? My Imax has the GPK and isolation balun but is mounted to the mast which is grounded to my earth ground system. Either way it cant hurt I guess.
 
We don't wrap anything round the conductive pole & overlap the pole/antenna mount to avoid any possible coupling @ RF frequencies but it way work if its thick enough.
I have always leaned this as well, it's easy for me to imagine some kind of capacitive coupling going on with the mast and a thin insulated material on metal pipe.
I tried to separate the mast completely.

73
Jeff
 
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I have pretty much read everything w8ji has written about antennas over the years. His info has really helped me with many things radio. His info on the Lazy H antenna really helped with that project, the other info I found on the net was not working as intended, a lot of bad building/specs info on that antenna.
I find that a 26' foot mast seems to be just fine for 10-11 meter. Many people battle the Common mode issue and dont really understand how to prevent it or stop it.
 
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