LONG-DELAY RADIO ECHOES..

[DXman]

LONG-DELAY RADIO ECHOES: During the geomagnetic storm of Nov. 27th, a brief but intense G2-class event, amateur radio operator Peter Brogl of Fürth, Germany experienced a strange phenomenon. Forty-six seconds after he transmitted his call sign at 7 MHz, he received an echo of his own transmission. "At first, I thought someone was playing tricks on me," says Brogl, "but I changed frequency, re-keyed my call sign (DK6NP), and got another echo." This went on for more than an hour, enough time for Brogl to make several recordings. First reported in 1927 by Norwegian civil engineer Jørgen Hals, long-delay radio echoes are rare and poorly understood. Unusual propagation conditions linked to solar storms is one of many possible explanations.*

*from Spaceweather.com front page (a recording of his echo is also there).

 

[GnG8d]

very cool

 

[cbradiomagazine.com]

It was just me recording him and playing it back.

 

[parallax]

so has anyone figured out what the signal bounced off of?
46 seconds x 186,000 miles a second equals 8,556,000 miles divided by 2 equals 4,278,000 miles away.. there is no astronomical body at 4,278,000 miles from earth.perhaps a passing meteor.or a piece of solar plasma from the storm,, thats scary.... makes you wonder, if in 20 years, we will start hearing transmissions from the 1930's..

 

[mackmobile43]

I remember my dad talking of the same event he encountered back in the later 1970's on 11 meters..

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

so has anyone figured out what the signal bounced off of?
46 seconds x 186,000 miles a second equals 8,556,000 miles divided by 2 equals 4,278,000 miles away.. there is no astronomical body at 4,278,000 miles from earth.perhaps a passing meteor.or a piece of solar plasma from the storm,, thats scary.... makes you wonder, if in 20 years, we will start hearing transmissions from the 1930's..

No one knows for sure what causes LDE's but it is known that they do not occur from bouncing off a single object like an asteroid etc. and tend to occur around periods of intense solar activity. It is theorized that the signal gets trapped between layers in the ionosphere, or possibly beyond, and travels many times around the earth before "falling through a hole" making it's way back to earth.

 

[loosecannon]

this phenomenon will be cited in the future as heralding in the age of time travel.

i actually typed this last year.
LC

 

[jazzsinger]

I heard a similar phenomenom back around 1980/81. my mates dad was dx'ing and a period after he unkeyed you could hear the unmistakeable sound of his cobra 148 gtl dx bleep along with the tail end of his call, it happened everytime he unkeyed.very strange occurence.

i've often wondered when hearing propagation i couldn't get back too if it was actually transmitted that day or was being returned to earth via one or many reflections off distant planets/stars etc.could even have been transmitted minutes or hours earlier through a duct in the ionosphere like Captain Kilowatt describes. that is why i laugh everytime i hear the statement "if you can hear it you can work it", that isn't necessarily so.

most people don't actually comprehend just how fast a radio wave travels, if you consider an aircraft travelling at Mach 1,the speed of sound,then your radio wave is travelling 881,000 times faster,approximately, gives you an idea just how difficult it is to design a spacecraft that is capable of light speed or above allowing intergalactic travels.

one thing is for certain,radio will always throw up the unexpected just when you least expect it.

 

[N0NB]

I heard a similar phenomenom back around 1980/81. my mates dad was dx'ing and a period after he unkeyed you could hear the unmistakeable sound of his cobra 148 gtl dx bleep along with the tail end of his call, it happened everytime he unkeyed.very strange occurence.

When it occurs immediately after unkeying, that is indicative of hearing your own signal via long path. I have heard that myself on occasion. As I understand it a radio wave takes about 1/3 of a second to go around the earth long path.

i've often wondered when hearing propagation i couldn't get back too if it was actually transmitted that day or was being returned to earth via one or many reflections off distant planets/stars etc.could even have been transmitted minutes or hours earlier through a duct in the ionosphere like Captain Kilowatt describes. that is why i laugh everytime i hear the statement "if you can hear it you can work it", that isn't necessarily so.

So far I've yet to experience an LDE and it would likely freak me out if I were to hear one. From what I've read is that they seem to be more prevalent at higher latitudes which may lead one to think that aurora may have something to do with it.

most people don't actually comprehend just how fast a radio wave travels, if you consider an aircraft travelling at Mach 1,the speed of sound,then your radio wave is travelling 881,000 times faster,approximately, gives you an idea just how difficult it is to design a spacecraft that is capable of light speed or above allowing intergalactic travels.

Before we worry about light speed, we're going to need to take a few more baby steps

one thing is for certain,radio will always throw up the unexpected just when you least expect it.

Amen. That's why I love radio.

 

[jazzsinger]

When it occurs immediately after unkeying, that is indicative of hearing your own signal via long path. I have heard that myself on occasion. As I understand it a radio wave takes about 1/3 of a second to go around the earth long path.

You could be right,whatever it was it was very strange to hear and i've never heard it since.

So far I've yet to experience an LDE and it would likely freak me out if I were to hear one. From what I've read is that they seem to be more prevalent at higher latitudes which may lead one to think that aurora may have something to do with it.

again you may have a point, the beauty of the unexplained is the specualtion of the causes.

Before we worry about light speed, we're going to need to take a few more baby steps

That might not be a bad thing, god forbid the uk or us governments ever developed such technology, after they raided other planets stealing oil or other minerals we could be facing martian or plutonian extremists attacking us.

Amen. That's why I love radio.

thats what puts the fun into radio.the unpredictable nature of it.