does anybody have a print on the old hygain big gun quad?If I remember correctly it had two driven elements on it, one for horz, and one for the vertical side.I was just wondering if you could set up a signal engineering quad like this.Thanks,smokercraft
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Old hygain quad
- Thread starter smokercraft
- Start date
Hello Smokecraft:
Impressive somebody is really thinking here......
I think thats a great call there! You will have to feed the Quad Loops thru a Balun and Matching System. This will take some doing but I think its worth doing.
The orginal hardware that signal engineering uses for a driven element support assembly will need to be made stronger, I can help. As two driven element wires and Baluns will need to be used. Or the original driven element hardware can be used for a prototype but reinforced and made stronger later once the matching is figured out.
The Big Gun II assembly instructions can be down loaded at:
http://www.cbtricks.com/ant.htm
Please let us know how it comes out.
Jay in the Mojave
http://www.a1antennas.com
Impressive somebody is really thinking here......
I think thats a great call there! You will have to feed the Quad Loops thru a Balun and Matching System. This will take some doing but I think its worth doing.
The orginal hardware that signal engineering uses for a driven element support assembly will need to be made stronger, I can help. As two driven element wires and Baluns will need to be used. Or the original driven element hardware can be used for a prototype but reinforced and made stronger later once the matching is figured out.
The Big Gun II assembly instructions can be down loaded at:
http://www.cbtricks.com/ant.htm
Please let us know how it comes out.
Jay in the Mojave
http://www.a1antennas.com
hygain big gun
Hi Jay, I am starting to do my tower work right now, I have one of the signal engineering plus 4 quads that I bought new.After reading all the trouble that people are having with the matching system on these antennas I thought I needed to come up with something different.My brother used to run a big gun back in the early days. It was a monster of a antenna. If I remember correctly on the driven element out on the ends it had a six inch stub that had a insulator attached to it. The insulator was in the shape of a T. This was how they fed it. And if my old mind serves me right I believe they just used a piece of 75 ohm coax as a matching stub hook directly to the 50 ohm coax.They had one for vertical and horz. But i believe you are correct, I would rather use a balum.What would you recommed for the insulator, some sort of plastic? I will keep you posted if I can get out of all these honey do jobs!! Arch
Hi Jay, I am starting to do my tower work right now, I have one of the signal engineering plus 4 quads that I bought new.After reading all the trouble that people are having with the matching system on these antennas I thought I needed to come up with something different.My brother used to run a big gun back in the early days. It was a monster of a antenna. If I remember correctly on the driven element out on the ends it had a six inch stub that had a insulator attached to it. The insulator was in the shape of a T. This was how they fed it. And if my old mind serves me right I believe they just used a piece of 75 ohm coax as a matching stub hook directly to the 50 ohm coax.They had one for vertical and horz. But i believe you are correct, I would rather use a balum.What would you recommed for the insulator, some sort of plastic? I will keep you posted if I can get out of all these honey do jobs!! Arch
Re: hygain big gun
Hello Arch:
Ok this was playing on my mind today while working the beams today in the hot Mojave Desert Sun.
Here is what I suggest you do to modify the quad beam antenna.
1- Assembly the quad antenna as per the assembly directions, and call the guys at signal engineering for help should you run into problems, they might be able to help out.
I am thinking the problems that are seen with these quads may be the guys getting the wrong color code wire out of order in the quad antennas directions. Because some guys say they work great and some say they don't work great. But you will need to folllow the directions, maybe someone can help you by double checking the quad assembly over for you as a second set of eyes, is always a a help.
I would also suggest that you verify that the reflector wire is longer than the driven element wire, and the driven element wire is longer than the director wires. This as a suggested method to verify the wires are correctly iditified by the color.
Once the antenna is assemblied and installed it will need to have a comparison field strength test to see if it is stronger than a comparison antenna this will tell ya if its ah humming.
2- Then I would modify the Diven Element with the RG11 or RG59 1/4 wavelength coax, feeding it, either Vertical or Horzontial and again do a comparison test in the same polarity as the test or comparison antenna. See if there is a differance.
3- Then modify the driven element with the duel vert and horz elements, and play around a little.
You may just have a neat-o project there. It would really help if you have a crank up tower and a one that also tilted over to work on the antenna. Theres a bunch of details I couldn't go into but I am sure you get the idea here.
Jay in the Mojave
Hello Arch:
Ok this was playing on my mind today while working the beams today in the hot Mojave Desert Sun.
Here is what I suggest you do to modify the quad beam antenna.
1- Assembly the quad antenna as per the assembly directions, and call the guys at signal engineering for help should you run into problems, they might be able to help out.
I am thinking the problems that are seen with these quads may be the guys getting the wrong color code wire out of order in the quad antennas directions. Because some guys say they work great and some say they don't work great. But you will need to folllow the directions, maybe someone can help you by double checking the quad assembly over for you as a second set of eyes, is always a a help.
I would also suggest that you verify that the reflector wire is longer than the driven element wire, and the driven element wire is longer than the director wires. This as a suggested method to verify the wires are correctly iditified by the color.
Once the antenna is assemblied and installed it will need to have a comparison field strength test to see if it is stronger than a comparison antenna this will tell ya if its ah humming.
2- Then I would modify the Diven Element with the RG11 or RG59 1/4 wavelength coax, feeding it, either Vertical or Horzontial and again do a comparison test in the same polarity as the test or comparison antenna. See if there is a differance.
3- Then modify the driven element with the duel vert and horz elements, and play around a little.
You may just have a neat-o project there. It would really help if you have a crank up tower and a one that also tilted over to work on the antenna. Theres a bunch of details I couldn't go into but I am sure you get the idea here.
Jay in the Mojave
hygain big gun
Hi Jay, Thank you for the info, I am in the process of building a fifty foot tilt over tower right now, my oldest son own a welding and fab shop so if I can keep the fire lite under him should be done next week. Just getting to old to climb anymore.My brother that used to run the big gun will help me with the assembly of the quad. I have a friend that lives close that has been building yagi and quad beams for many years and he can't wait to get his hands in this one.He also owns a mfj 259 so i won't have to buy one. He is close enought so we will be able to compare this quad with his home made four element to another friend that lives down the road about 25 miles. We went threw the the hardware bag and found that I need to upgrade clamps and probably screws.I am sure he will have alot of ideas.Once again thank you and I will keep you posted.arch
Hi Jay, Thank you for the info, I am in the process of building a fifty foot tilt over tower right now, my oldest son own a welding and fab shop so if I can keep the fire lite under him should be done next week. Just getting to old to climb anymore.My brother that used to run the big gun will help me with the assembly of the quad. I have a friend that lives close that has been building yagi and quad beams for many years and he can't wait to get his hands in this one.He also owns a mfj 259 so i won't have to buy one. He is close enought so we will be able to compare this quad with his home made four element to another friend that lives down the road about 25 miles. We went threw the the hardware bag and found that I need to upgrade clamps and probably screws.I am sure he will have alot of ideas.Once again thank you and I will keep you posted.arch
S.E. sure could of had better hardware and better
assembly instructions. I thought they were both
below average on my White Lightning.
I had my SWRS good when i first bought it. Then, a
large bird sat on the fiberglass rod and pulled it
out of the hub. Took me weeks afterwards to get
SWR correct again. When they are working correctly,
S.E. Quads do some smokin.
Good luck with your project....
Let us know how you make out....
assembly instructions. I thought they were both
below average on my White Lightning.
I had my SWRS good when i first bought it. Then, a
large bird sat on the fiberglass rod and pulled it
out of the hub. Took me weeks afterwards to get
SWR correct again. When they are working correctly,
S.E. Quads do some smokin.
Good luck with your project....
Let us know how you make out....
Well I am back, Son finally got the tilt over tower built.He did a nice job adding a counter weight to the bottom and he is in the process of building me a winch system to help with the raising and lowering of it.Got all of the new stainless hardware bought for the quad.Now if I can get where I work to let me quit work 6-7 days a week things may happen around here. Jay I have been think about rotating the quad in the elevation mode. I used to do that with a four element yagi beam years ago between vert/horz.I have to buy a new rotor anyway and I have been looking at the yaesu g-5400. I could then run one coax (times 400uf ) and just flop the thing. The spec's on the rotor seem to have more that enought wind load for the antenna. Has anybody done anything like this or will it even work on the quad? Thanks guys.
Hello Smokercraft:
Certainly this can be done, I don't know if the rotor is the way to go.
May I suggest you first get the quad antenna working first, assembling it as the instructions show, which are pretty sketchy at best? Field strength testing needs to be done with two more test antennas, I can e-mail you on this procedure,
And photos will be needed!
According to one of the antenna book authors, a former Navy Engineer, the quad antennas has elements in both vertical and horizontal, and may work pretty well for both polarities. I have not measured this myself, so I do not have a hands on measurement.
Also the antenna gurus that write the antenna programs seem to think that tilting the antenna will not have a desired effect. I will agree with them on this one.
But the boys in the band have been proven wrong too many times so it worth a try I think. You may want to put up a temporarily assembly allowing the antenna to be tilted, then returned to the normal angle, for comparison.
The performance of the Hy-Gain Gig Gun II may work good enough by itself.
Jay in the Mojave
Certainly this can be done, I don't know if the rotor is the way to go.
May I suggest you first get the quad antenna working first, assembling it as the instructions show, which are pretty sketchy at best? Field strength testing needs to be done with two more test antennas, I can e-mail you on this procedure,
And photos will be needed!
According to one of the antenna book authors, a former Navy Engineer, the quad antennas has elements in both vertical and horizontal, and may work pretty well for both polarities. I have not measured this myself, so I do not have a hands on measurement.
Also the antenna gurus that write the antenna programs seem to think that tilting the antenna will not have a desired effect. I will agree with them on this one.
But the boys in the band have been proven wrong too many times so it worth a try I think. You may want to put up a temporarily assembly allowing the antenna to be tilted, then returned to the normal angle, for comparison.
The performance of the Hy-Gain Gig Gun II may work good enough by itself.
Jay in the Mojave
smokercraft said:
Those HY GAIN BIG GUN II are awesome no doubt. Here is mine up at 65 ft to the boom 72 ft to the top
http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae305/PONYEXPRESS/BIGGUNIIQUAD.jpg
http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae305/PONYEXPRESS/P1010458.jpg
http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae305/PONYEXPRESS/P1010459-1.jpg
http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae305/PONYEXPRESS/BigGunII-2.jpg
Impressive antenna.
I have only heard one of those antennas on the air.
OP was in NY state and he literally put the S meter needle all the way to the right. Other DX stations in NY were also coming in but he buried the receive needle and not just once but basically every time he transmitted.
I asked if he was using any external power and he said no, just 20 w PEP.
When the band opens up a Quad is a great antenna to have in the antenna farm.
thanks for the picture.
I have only heard one of those antennas on the air.
OP was in NY state and he literally put the S meter needle all the way to the right. Other DX stations in NY were also coming in but he buried the receive needle and not just once but basically every time he transmitted.
I asked if he was using any external power and he said no, just 20 w PEP.
When the band opens up a Quad is a great antenna to have in the antenna farm.
thanks for the picture.
I started out with a 4 element Hygain quad it had 2 wire loops, one for each polarity with a 1/4 wave 75ohm section to match it to 50 ohm coax. It worked good but over the years I managed to get my hands on a lot of antenna types, "My business" . I had a pdl 2 and then tried the Moon raker 4 but they didn't have enough back and side rejection so got a Signal Engineering 2 element Quad Loved it , then the SE 4 quad however wanted more , Tried a Super Laser 500 however to big and still had to much coming in from the back and sides . I finally bought Lightning 6 the largest they had at the time from Signal Emerging all I can say is WOW this antenna I had on a 40' Windmill tower was fantastic . Now I read some reports of cheep construction but I had a few I sold they held up just fine I did buy a rebuild kit for mine after about 18 years in the air . It was showing some wear on the little cross tubes where the fiberglass spreaders attached and I felt if I had used common sense I could have eliminated the wear with silicon to dampen any vibration from the wind . We had little ice here in San Antonio so that never bothered these antennas . Now with all the quads I have used the Signal Emerging feed system was really simple and easy to use so If I ever made my own for ham use I would use the matching system it is pure genius. I talked to the owners one time asking if thy would build Ham version and they said no but can't help but think they would still be in business if they had. Of course I really don't know why they sold out, just wish they would stayed in business.
Try this link for the new owner's of the Lightning Quad Antenna's.
http://www.lightningantennas.com/
http://www.lightningantennas.com/
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