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Base Sirio 2008 vs 2016

Greg T

945 (Jazz Singer) Upper Peninsula of Michigan
Sep 18, 2014
601
828
103
68
Escanaba, Michigan
How did this work out for you? I have been eyeballing that same antenna for my own personal and selfish needs

Well, I couldn't find a 2016 in the states for under 300 bux (gougers) so I got the 2008. Still haven't had the chance to put it into service. It's been sitting on the couch for a month. I plan to get it up as soon as the weather permits. Been an ugly spring
 

snippits75

Sr. Member
Nov 11, 2019
345
508
103
I installed a Sirio 2016 couple weeks ago. Very easy to put together. The tuning table for 27.185(19) at 330 mm(13 inches) was dead on the money for me. Used a Rig Expert AA-35 to tune it.

Channel 1 was 1.15. Channel 20 was 1.02. Channel 40 was 1.17. R=49.5 X=0.93

With a fifty foot piece of RG 8X to tune the antenna, the above was about the same except the resonant frequency was Channel 15. Checked it in the house at the end of a 85 ft. run of RG 213, and everything the same except the resonant frequency had changed to 25.490...weird. Dialed the Rig Expert to 25.490, and the SWR was 2.4.

Anyway, the antenna is working very good at 21 ft. to the radiator.
 
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Greg T

945 (Jazz Singer) Upper Peninsula of Michigan
Sep 18, 2014
601
828
103
68
Escanaba, Michigan
Well, not a very good pic, but I finally got it up. Loaded up perfectly. I did the math and tuned it for channel 30 and the entire band isn't over 1.12:1.
In fact, I can go to my alternate of 27.705 and still be 1.2. Haven't had the chance to check performance yet, but will do this week if conditions are good.2008-1.jpg
 

freecell

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the effects of the ground and the ground system are twofold. near the antenna (in the near field) you need a good ground system to collect the antenna return currents without losses, this will determine the radiation efficiency of the antenna. (Verticals Chapter 9, Uli Weiss / Dj2YA)

this goes for ground mounted monopoles as well as the popular elevated above earth ground plane antenna sporting the artificial ground radial design regardless of operating wavelength. the larger the number of radials, the higher the levels of antenna current that are collected and returned to the other side of the circuit for every cycle of the frequency in use. radial systems that are not densely populated allow these antenna currents to pass between small numbers of widely spaced radials and the antenna current is dissipated in the lossy ground below the antenna.

generally speaking, with no exceptions that i have encountered, as the number of radials is increased, losses are reduced and the antenna radiation efficiency is increased, without fail.

sirio gets the nod from me, it's about time.
 
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secret squirrel

Lustrous Potentate
Oct 5, 2008
536
1,135
153
Washington, PA
Forgive my lack of knowledge when I ask this. Not trying to Hijack the thread. When I looked at the online diagrams from the ground mounted antennas. It brings up the question. If I am understanding this correctly- burying the radials in the ground will still be make an improvement if the antenna is a quarter to half wave in the air.
 

freecell

BANNED
Apr 6, 2005
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Forgive my lack of knowledge when I ask this. Not trying to Hijack the thread. When I looked at the online diagrams from the ground mounted antennas. It brings up the question. If I am understanding this correctly- burying the radials in the ground will still be make an improvement if the antenna is a quarter to half wave in the air.

yes, either on the ground or buried below the surface.
 

Greg T

945 (Jazz Singer) Upper Peninsula of Michigan
Sep 18, 2014
601
828
103
68
Escanaba, Michigan
the effects of the ground and the ground system are twofold. near the antenna (in the near field) you need a good ground system to collect the antenna return currents without losses, this will determine the radiation efficiency of the antenna. (Verticals Chapter 9, Uli Weiss / Dj2YA)

this goes for ground mounted monopoles as well as the popular elevated above earth ground plane antenna sporting the artificial ground radial design regardless of operating wavelength. the larger the number of radials, the higher the levels of antenna current that are collected and returned to the other side of the circuit for every cycle of the frequency in use. radial systems that are not densely populated allow these antenna currents to pass between small numbers of widely spaced radials and the antenna current is dissipated in the lossy ground below the antenna.

generally speaking, with no exceptions that i have encountered, as the number of radials is increased, losses are reduced and the antenna radiation efficiency is increased, without fail.

sirio gets the nod from me, it's about time.


I tried like hell to get the 2016 (16 ground radials) but I could not find one anywhere. I'm glad I got this one at the time I did because there weren't any of these left shortly after I ordered.
 

freecell

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"a good radial system improves the efficiency of the vertical in COLLECTing return currents and shielding from lossy ground...."

"unless the feed line is radiating, you will have exactly the same current into the radial (system) as you have in the form of common-mode current exciting the vertical. That is the “push against” effect of the radials. this is also how the antenna return currents are COLLECTed."

"K3NA was concerned with two aspects: the efficiency issue, which is related to the task of COLLECTing return currents in the vicinity of a lossy ground and doing so with the smallest possible losses."

"there are two good ways to COLLECT the currents in the many radials at the base of the vertical."

"If you use only a small number of radials, perhaps 1 to 8, their task will be almost exclusively to efficiently COLLECT the return currents of the vertical, and you will have to suffer substantial near-field losses in the ground, up to 5 dB.."

"measuring the impedance of a vertical and watching it decrease as you add radials tells us nothing about the near-field absorption ground losses. It only gives us an indication of the I2R losses that determine return-current COLLECTing efficiency."

these excerpts are from the DJ2YA Verticals Chapter 9 pdf posted above.
 
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Greg T

945 (Jazz Singer) Upper Peninsula of Michigan
Sep 18, 2014
601
828
103
68
Escanaba, Michigan
"a good radial system improves the efficiency of the vertical in COLLECTing return currents and shielding from lossy ground...."

"unless the feed line is radiating, you will have exactly the same current into the radial (system) as you have in the form of common-mode current exciting the vertical. That is the “push against” effect of the radials. this is also how the antenna return currents are COLLECTed."

"K3NA was concerned with two aspects: the efficiency issue, which is related to the task of COLLECTing return currents in the vicinity of a lossy ground and doing so with the smallest possible losses."

"there are two good ways to COLLECT the currents in the many radials at the base of the vertical."

"If you use only a small number of radials, perhaps 1 to 8, their task will be almost exclusively to efficiently COLLECT the return currents of the vertical, and you will have to suffer substantial near-field losses in the ground, up to 5 dB.."

"measuring the impedance of a vertical and watching it decrease as you add radials tells us nothing about the near-field absorption ground losses. It only gives us an indication of the I2R losses that determine return-current COLLECTing efficiency."

these excerpts are from the DJ2YA Verticals Chapter 9 pdf posted above.

Without knowing the full context, I really don't know exactly what is being said. Am I to assume that he is saying this antenna would be better for DX and less efficient for local work?
 
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Handy Andy

Do Your Research First, Then Decide...
Apr 23, 2018
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I really don't know exactly what is being said.

As to what was posted by others - there is a term used when attempts are made to confuse others by providing TOO much information they cannot use.

As to what your results would be in using the antenna - too many "Terms" obfuscate what you really should know, and do..

Use what works for you, if you like the results - then skip the rest and just enjoy it for what it can provide you in entertainment, enlightenment and enjoyment.

If you wish to be left alone, just stop here, but if you, the reader, are curious - please continue to scrutinize this study...

The above is just starting with the letter "e" - there's 25 other letters and a plethora of synonyms - an entire Thesaurus can be used here...

You did the work, enjoy the fruits of your labor and employ your effort. Use It! Do this, for your needs, in generating emissions in the 27MHz band of Radio Frequencies, as allotted and allocated by the FCC, ITU as well as other regulatory agencies.

Hey - it's CB - It's RF - Get out there and say Hello! (Following proper protocol to reduce interference of course)

Ignore the information that does not apply to your situation. Much of what has been said in this thread has been repeated - duplicated - disseminated - before.

  • Nature Abhors a Vacuum
upload_2021-7-24_9-11-26.png

However, you'd be Diligent to Heed and consider information you can use and exploit to your advantage - you have erected an implement, purposed this utensil as a tool, transformed materials into something useful that many don't consider as a viable mechanism in which to communicate - until their efforts to use their own equipment is exhausted.

Just continue to apply your desire to make the antenna a functional part of the foundation of your station.

You have procured, constructed, installed, secured, tuned, tested and properly placed one of the items in a fashion that allows it to become an operational gadget, an antenna, which is the subject of this thread.

Your desires and direct application of effort in the endeavor of creating an environment to supplant your needs of communication, this item seems to have affected specific users to take action and are now motivated to produce long dissertations and endless discussion concerning these appliances.

You contrived the idea, acquired the materials, assessed the required courses of action, assembled and created the monstrosity. All done by using your own hands, as a means to build the device. You are now able to exercise, execute and operate; in a manageable and tangible effort, the abilities of this antenna in an efficient and functional means along with the propensity to utilize it's functional features and authorize the devices own inherited traits of character as performance capabilities to produce work. Now, by your efforts in this endeavor, you have methodically created an apparatus, others can only envy.

This unit can provide an effective way to send and receive signals

  • - They seem to be jealous about it.

[HUMOR=Off]

...Sorry, forgot to reset a flag....

(... At The Risk Of Being Redundant ...)

Did I also forget to mention - "10-8 and standin' straight"?

Good Job!
 
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jdchet

Supporting Member
Jan 19, 2002
403
388
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Rootstown, Ohio
upload_2021-7-24_9-11-26-png.45953

Fascinating...........

JD
 

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