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Videos showing a complete alignment (TX/RX) ???

Could not agree more with all points in your reply.

And again, (and I do NOT say this bitterly at all!) I will get through it. I've got education and training (old.... but still there!), I have a wealth of materials available the describe how the circuits involved work and why they work the way that do.... and all of it makes sense! I have a good bit of equipment (not just a DMM and a screwdriver... a Tek scope, a spectrum analyzer, a 1.3 GHz counter, VTVM, several DMMs, a 500 MHz Boonton RF sig-gen, even an sinad meter... and an understandig of what they are for and how you use them) and , to me.... this is fun!!!!!!

Additionally, I will not be foisting my "learning process" on others. I have (probably) 10 or so older radios, some AM, some AM/SSB and will be confining my "fun" to these poor hapless pieces of equipment!!!!! :)

pick up any SAMS manual and it lays bare the whole process.
......
Well, aside from all the nuance involved.
.........
And that's where the rubber meets the road my friends.
the nuance.
..........
Point being that when it comes to the essence of the art, no one wants to teach you for free.

Sure, Van Gogh might teach you a brush stroke or two, but he's not going to show you how he mixes color!
LC
 
Thank you LB, I will see what I can find on these other video sources and I appreciate you letting me know!

And, yes, I started playing at 10 and am now 65. Never had a lesson, learned by ear and it has given me years of fun.....and.... I also play in a band at various places (VFW Posts, Moose Lodges, a few clubs and restaurants) for extra cash!

Good for you for finding your way back to it! I know that even when I am not "playing out" I can't go more than a day or two without finding one of my guitars and inflicting it on anyone within earshot!

If some of his videos are still floating around. The Cobra man, possible Mike's radio Repair. There was one I knew for sure but have not seen his channel on you tube and I can not find his videos. Arties Garage, had a whole start to finish tuning a 148 GTL. Also he went under Protec electronics. I think possibly he passed away.

Off the subject. You must be a guitar player. I recently picked up my guitar again. I find the calluses on my fingers make it awful difficult working on radios. LOL
Gary
 
Wiser words were never spoken!

With the help of my education and ( I would like to think ) common sense..... when I watch YT videos... the "filters" are on... if you know what I mean. I watch with an eye for "does that make sense or not".

IMO YT is full of garbage and learning from that source is a bad idea.
Get a service manual, everything there is described clear and step by step.
Mike
 
Hmmm...

When you say - "Peak and tune" - what is it you're looking for?

Best receiver performance - highest REJECTION and SELECTIVITY, or BEST RECEPTION for Weak stations?

Best Transmitter performance - Highest SWING and Audio available or lowest level of spurries and interference - you staying out of other peoples stuff?

Might want to take a number on this - you may be in for a wait.

A lot of this is subjective, as you've already found out.

For if one person does your "tune" on the radio you use, yet it's not right - by your standards - who is in the wrong?

You? For not being specific? Or, the tech, for just simply following orders?

As you may already know from your own experiences and by reading a lot of the reviews here on the Forum (thank you) - you can also see a lot of "fluff" embedded in with them. As stated by other sites that uses SALES for their bottom line, you can easily get swept away by the hype and quality claims - but one thing you cannot ignore, is their prices.

So when it comes to just getting a radio, versus a performance issue with the radio you have, you may want to investigate and research the questions you have - for thoroughly going over and reviewing the radio, you also will see one other thing that is not mentioned in this thread.

Each radio has a different signature or fingerprint - what makes it different from the others.

Each one uses the functional blocks like the others, but one thing will stand out amongst all the competition.

Each one requires, needs - a slightly different tune up process than the other platforms - EVEN IN IT'S OWN BRAND or LINE or makes.

When you re-read this message - several times, one thing does stand out.

Each "tech" has their own way to tune, and focus of their "tune" is in specific areas of expertise, like; receiver, VCO, Transmitter or Audio processes. Many techs have their Strong suits, and would rather have you enjoy radio the way they like to enjoy it. But you don't always find the right Tech, let alone the Tech having the fortune of finding the right Buyer to make that sale work.

So, why "techs" don't like to handle critique - is not unlike how one car is favored over another if only you had three choices to select that vehicle.

Color,
Performance.
Cost (price as well as to own)

Pick any two.
 
Because most of those techs do those alignments as their means of making a living, is probably the reason. And then there are the sidelines and living room ref who's always quick to critique because no 2 techs do it right enough or the same. A real tech or good tech is already becoming a dying breed, add the diy'ers to the mix and it adds more nails to the coffin.
In the old days you aligned your radio equipment yourself. If you had trouble other operators would help you. There is no big secret on how to do it. Service manuals guide you step by step on how to do it. Its only the cb guys that try to keep everything hush hush like there is some kind of special voodoo involved and skills only they have. Just about anyone can align a transmitter or receiver. You just have to dive in try it and learn.
 
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Well..... I am an odd one here...... possibly not too typical.

For one.... "peak and tune" is a term I generally don't use. For others.... I don't so much care....but for me..... it generally makes me think of twisting anything that moves and watching a watt meter. Anything that makes the needle go to the right.... stays that way... without regard for being "on frequency" or even "in band"! It just hits me that way....

Two.... I am not wanting to do this to "con" or even "sell" to anyone else. It is kind of a "bucket list" thing for me. It is something that I just want to do here late in life.

So for me..... it probably boils down to these items..... (oddly, following most SAMS alignment procedures I have ever seen! :) )

1. Frequency synthesis is "on frequency".
2. Receive is aligned to give me the best possible sensitivity for the given radio and the quietest receive audio I can get.
3. Transmit aligned to be on frequency with each stage operating at it's best, driver/final bias set properly, power set where it should be for the radio (which will NOT make me popular with some hobbyists! ) , and I know where that little 54 MHz area is on my spectrum analyzer and intend to minimize whatever I see there.

With regard to power..... if I ever were to consider that I needed more power....... I am funny on this subject. I am one of those nuts that believes in "clean spectrum" and "garbage in - garbage out". I would focus on having a radio operating right and as clean as I can make it....and go get an amp. dirty -> AMP = BIGGER DIRTY!

On this path I expect to run into a few cores that are stubborn in turning (maybe even break!), I expect to run into tuning steps that don't tune right... it's all part of the game.

Seriously, I want to learn to do it as "right" as I can.

Hmmm...

When you say - "Peak and tune" - what is it you're looking for?
 
Oh I have experienced this before. Back when I entered the work force out of college.... I ran in to a few who would not share/tutor the newbies. I guess they felt it was "job security". Doesn't work so well when you have a "Stubborn head" like me! I learned IN SPITE of that....and when I did... I taught everybody I could! I think that makes a better work force.... but that is just me!

73

In he old days you aligned your radio equipment yourself. If you had trouble otger operators would help you. There is no big secret on how to do it. Service manuals guide you step by step on how to do it. Its only the cb guys that try to keep everything hush hush like there is some kind of special voodoo involved and skills only they have. Just about anyone can align a transmitter or receiver. You just have to dive in try it and learn.
 
Seriously, I want to learn to do it as "right" as I can.

Then this nicely narrows down the choices you want done.

Basically, you want to be able to do this yourself - I kinda' knew that but I had to clarify just what you VALUE in operating a radio.

You've narrowed down your "pick" list.

Selectivity, Sensitivity (although you may find they do contradict each other. because as you'll find out- both can inject a level of noise and frustration you have to tolerate to obtain these values.)

Good Quality Audio - Not focused on Quantity - QUALITY - makes a difference in approach.

So let's go another level here,

You want DISCERNMENT - not just Reception. You want a low noise floor, but the ability to DISCERN that which may be buried in the noise.
  • That brings up filtering.
  • Noise abatement - Blanker and Noise Limiter functions.
  • Tone
You want CLARITY in your transmitted audio...

So that brings up Filtering - but also Envelope - the amount of what you want in it.

Ok, two aspects that you've narrowed down...

So for many techs - they look at the TX side as a simple Tune to the max level - and in the way many CB radios are designed for this, They (the maker) tell you that in their service manual
  • As you will find out. The Radio may "track" receiver reception side of it's generated IF, but you -by following the Service manual- have to tune to the Transmitted side first, to obtain a level of performance you need to maintain for clarity of transmission.
  • The IF the radio uses generates both it's receive and transmit - but use IMAGES during detection.
    • You have to locate and tune to which image they decided on, doesn't mean it's the best, but FCC dictates the EMISSIONS so that in itself limits the Makers ability to choose the best, or idealized, just the most likely not to interfere and yet, pass - the FCC's own certifications.
    • For IF itself may not seem like much, but in using a radio GENERATING a signal to help it receive signals - makes this not just a simple job of filtering this all down - you have to obtain a mixing product of the internal signal the radio makes - to obtain another at a different frequency.
    • IF you don't do this right, as in make the radio work properly - no tune up in the world will help it, it's a self-declared mess when it can generate and interfere with others radios just having it on, sitting by them. The FCC doesn't want that.
Here's your challenge...

Many Radio techs will tune the radio to meet/match those specs listed in the Service Manual - but then too, it only serves as a Guide to help you restore it to the health that it had when it was made to factory.

Now here's the part I brought up earlier...
For if one person does your "tune" on the radio you use, yet it's not right - by your standards - who is in the wrong?
Look at that phrase very carefully. Because of where it hit's you, in the pocketbook and in your ability to enjoy operating your radio - both in Reception and Transmission of your signal.

By your standards!

It can cost a lot, in time, money and effort - to only improve your radios ability to be a quality performer by your standards. This may result - in only small percentages of improvement or modification - over similar radio designs - even in the same Brand or amongst the different makers still out there.

So the next step in this - is your desire to spend how much to obtain that which you wish to attain if you just only do some little steps in reception and transmission - but not just at the radio - but to your SYSTEM to attain the lower noise levels and the ability to transmit your signal without causing interference.,

You can have the best radio money can buy, but it's not gong to do you any good if you're using an antenna and system that is about as efficient in radiating a signal as a 50 ohm dummy load...

On top of....

You wanting to tune the radio for the best performance, in the CONDITIONS you operate it in.

So - performance is subjective, Natures' Conditions are not, they are the Challenge in which the radio operates in.

So in light of what you may look for in tune-ups and "How-To-Guides" others may show, but then once it's in your hands - you have the choices, guidance and resources - to make that radio perform like you want it to. Asking "How I do This" is great, but the word "This" can be considered an Adverb, Determiner, Interjection or even a Pronoun - it is the quandary, "This" can be considered the challenge - we can only guide you.

So really, looking to a Magician to see how they do their tricks, isn't going to help you pull this rabbit out of the hat.

You first have to obtain a rabbit.
 
the white whale!

the unicorn of CB repair!

That girl on TV who wants to talk to you late at night!

LOL

This is really the most elusive subject when it comes to CB repair.
The tune!

pick up any SAMS manual and it lays bare the whole process.

Well, aside from all the nuance involved.

And that's where the rubber meets the road my friends.
the nuance.

It reminds me of a welder i worked with many years ago.

The shop was full of young 'badasses' when it came to metal fabrication, and one of the guys we looked up to got his dad hired on as a welder.
We had been regaled with many a story about where he got his skills and all the school dances he missed because of dad keeping him busy in the shop on school nights.

So naturally, when he came in, and struck an arc, we all grabbed our hoods and tried to catch a glimpse of what he was doing.
I happened to be one of those who caught him on a bad (hungover) day, and while we were watching, he lifted his hood and shouted aloud, "I ain't no school"

We got the hint and left him alone after that.

Point being that when it comes to the essence of the art, no one wants to teach you for free.

Sure, Van Gogh might teach you a brush stroke or two, but he's not going to show you how he mixes color!

This was not lost on me when i first got interested enough in this hobby to buy a set of tuning tools, and because of that once i felt i had learned what exactly was involved in an alignment, i made a thread on the old Copper forum spilling what i thought were the secrets.

As the years have passed, i went from laughing at my old thread to being somewhat embarrassed by it.
Like, i thought i knew how to play the solo to Stairway to Heaven, but now i can't stand to listen to the old tapes of me trying.

I will probably still feel that way about the way i do it now 10 years from now.

All that being said, i continue to search for the same thing that was asked in the first post in this thread. A video of someone showing 'how it's done'.

Why don't i just post a video of it myself?
Well, for the same reason i won't play in a Led Zeppelin cover band.
I'm afraid of all the critiques from the rest of the people trying to cop Jimmy P.

I think that if ham radios were as 'basic' as CB radios when youtube became a thing, we might have a master lesson available, but if such a thing exists, i haven't found it.

I do believe that i learned what i know from reputable sources, but it wasn't spoonfed, and i still find better ways of doing things every year.

Kopsicle gets the credit for teaching me my latest lesson about IF tuning.
That doesn't mean that he deserves to have his inbox flooded LOL.

IDK, after typing all this, maybe i will work up the bravery to show the world how i do things, but i can't say how well i'll handle the inevitable 'that ain't how we do it in Greesnsborough'! comments.

I certainly don't consider myself a teacher, but i guess i could be persuaded to lean back and let other students cheat off my test.
LC

Go ahead and post a video. If anyone wants to criticize the easiest thing to do is ask them how they'd do it. They can either tell you, post their own video, or STFU and STFD.

If they continue to criticize without offering to help build up your skills you know it's safe to ignore their ignorant and arrogant asses.

And from what I've seen of YouTube comments, that's probably what most of the people posting videos do.
 
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I'm not surprised people (techs/shops) aren't posting videos, the internet is still the wild west.

In addition to not wanting to teach people how to do what they pay you to do, I just look at some of the discussions on forums regarding different shops and techs and in some ways - less visibility is better for many of the techs/shops especially if they aren't highly trained and certified in their field.

Also I bet some of our forum members have more experience than some of the people that make videos

Unless your test equipment is brand new, you have a PHD in electrical engineering, and don't make a single mistake in explaining anything during the video you can expect to get negative comments and catch some flak :)

There's a reason the comment section on many channels is disabled.
 
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I wish I had kept count of how many radios' alignment procedures came directly from the schematic diagram, and nothing more.

When a schemo is all the data you can obtain, there's no other way.

And way too often, a factory procedure wastes time getting a result the long way around.

Maybe they want to make it seem simpler? Harder to foul up?

Don't know, don't care. It's still all about the result. How you get there is less important.

74
 
I wish I had kept count of how many radios' alignment procedures came directly from the schematic diagram, and nothing more.

When a schemo is all the data you can obtain, there's no other way.

And way too often, a factory procedure wastes time getting a result the long way around.

Maybe they want to make it seem simpler? Harder to foul up?

Don't know, don't care. It's still all about the result. How you get there is less important.

74
Back in the day I had some sort of Superstar 10 meter import/export Cb. It had cans all over the place for the RX and TX alignment. and it was SSB so not to mention offsets. All the info on the net. was wrong.
Lazarus came up with a alignment procedure off a schematic and that radio was dead on and sounded great. Thanks again Laz. where ever you are.
 
Back in the day I had some sort of Superstar 10 meter import/export Cb. It had cans all over the place for the RX and TX alignment. and it was SSB so not to mention offsets. All the info on the net. was wrong.
Lazarus came up with a alignment procedure off a schematic and that radio was dead on and sounded great. Thanks again Laz. where ever you are.
Good stuff from the cbt greats right there! Wonder where Lazarus is these days...
 

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