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What kind of Local distance? 10/11 meters.

From Hendersinville TN I have talked across Ky into the edge if WV no skip. I have talked to IL, Indiana, & Alabama ground wave no skip base station to base station. I guess the WV station was a lil over 330 miles. I'm not kidding. Running a Wild Bill .64 ground plane 81 foot to base. Antenna is over 30' itself. So it's over 100' tall. not gonna talk about the power lol.

On the Mobile. I talked from Antioch TN Fall Creek Falls TN. Mobile to base. That's 125+ air miles. And from Hendersonville TN to Owensboro KY 115+ miles mobile to base. Twister 2x8. Sirio P5000 antenna.
 
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Curious..
Do you have a link to that
Wild Bill .64 ground plane ?

Robb...55 miles is Not Persay Skip
Maybe in car to car.

With Good radio and Especially Excellent antenna
Especially with good location and good height.
Getting out becomes rather easy.

I would get out Much better myself.
If i was not in the middle of the nyc/nj metro area.
The RF interference around here is Plentiful.

Just an hour north of me.
Although up in the mountains.
at night especially..Parked in my front yard.
i would get out 500-650 miles..Every night (after 10:30 pm)

Equipment always plays a factor.
More so your antenna and antenna height.
Of course location location and location
 
From Hendersinville TN I have talked across Ky into the edge if WV no skip. I have talked to IL, Indiana, & Alabama ground wave no skip base station to base station. I guess the WV station was a lil over 330 miles. I'm not kidding. Running a Wild Bill .64 ground plane 81 foot to base. Antenna is over 30' itself. So it's over 100' tall. not gonna talk about the power lol.

On the Mobile. I talked from Antioch TN Fall Creek Falls TN. Mobile to base. That's 125+ air miles. And from Hendersonville TN to Owensboro KY 115+ miles mobile to base. Twister 2x8. Sirio P5000 antenna.

Defying the laws of physics. LOL. You guys really need to do some reading about HF propagation. Those long distance contacts are not ground wave propagation. Most likely tropospheric ducting similar to what occurs with other VHF frequencies.
 
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Defying the laws of physics. LOL. You guys really need to do some reading about HF propagation. Those long distance contacts are not ground wave propagation. Most likely tropospheric ducting similar to what occurs with other VHF frequencies.
[emphasis mine]

Yep. Ground wave is what permits MWBC stations to be heard consistently for a thousand miles or more, and ground wave doesn't exist above about 3 MHz. On HF, it's called "direct wave"; above HF it's tropo or other types of ducting.
 
What it's called and what it is . . .
In English it's cat, in Spanish it's gato, they are the same, no?

In these Ozarks I can talk 20 - 35 miles easily, but there have been times whan at night skip left and I was able to talk up into Missouri and Oklahoma 65 - 70 miles on AM. No big deal for those who have level country around them.
Just yesterday, in the day light, on SSB I held a conversation to a station directly south of me over the Boston Mountains that was south of Fort Smith from here in the middle of Rogers, a air distance of about 75 miles. I was using a vertical dipole, 125 watts PEP, and a RCI 2950.

dipolefp2.jpg
 
[emphasis mine]

On HF, it's called "direct wave"; above HF it's tropo or other types of ducting.

I know Beetle, but you said it is called different names on different freqs, so I was responding to what you said.
I realize some call one thing another thing, as in naming their dog kitty, or their cat rover, So if it isn't the same thing then it shouldn't have different names, they should be called different things because they aren't the same thing.
I was just straining on the finer points as you tend to do.

I think I need more practice as I almost choked to death over that little gnat of a point.

I once posted a series of SWR measurements as 1.1 or 1.2 or 1.5 and was given a lesson in the SWR measurement being a ratio and was not properly expressed until the person added a colon and a 1 behind (or as they tend to do on the Continent, in front of). It was not a true SWR measurement without the colon one in spite of the fact that anyone likely to read the thread would have likely known what was meant.
There after, I reported all my SWR reading with the :1 to the point of unnecessary exhaustion in deference to those who stumbled so steeply over that little thing.

Then I bought an MFJ-259b and set about using it. The ignorant, uneducated , moronic thing kept on reporting all the SWR readings it took without that little old :1. I yelled at it, I shook it, I read from the ARRL antenna handbook to it, I offered it a bribe, and I even threatened to tell off on it to the antenna police on the internet forums, but it still persisted in reporting SWR without the :1. . .

So far, when I show photos of my MFJ-259b readings no one has ever failed to understand the way it shows SWR readings. . .

Go figure . . .
 
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[emphasis mine]

Yep. Ground wave is what permits MWBC stations to be heard consistently for a thousand miles or more, and ground wave doesn't exist above about 3 MHz. On HF, it's called "direct wave"; above HF it's tropo or other types of ducting.

I thought it existed above 3 MHz but it's distance is measured in feet not miles.
 
Great thread! I just got my license and a rig but I don't know if it's working. I hear other bands but never heard anything on 10 meters. (I did hear somebody once that I think was in Europe). Is there anything I can hear in central Michigan? I am wondering how 10 meters compares to 2 meters. It sounds like they both get about the same coverage simplex.
 
Well over 125 miles on SSB from my Moonraker 4 equipped station (antenna at 60') on a good quiet night... About 40 miles on AM on a good night... So my mode of choice is SSB!
 
, So if it isn't the same thing then it shouldn't have different names, they should be called different things because they aren't the same thing.
I was just straining on the finer points as you tend to do..

As far as the MFJ, the operator's manual (or at least my copy of it) specifies that all the readings are referenced to 1 (xxx:1).

As far as "ground wave", I agree. In referring to terms such as "ground wave", one should have the knowledge of just what "ground wave" is, and isn't. Tropo ducting isn't the same thing as ground wave, but how many people (hams and non-hams) use the terms interchangeably? Too many!

That which is frequently called "ground wave" above ~3 MHz is properly called "direct wave".
 

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