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WORKMAN 5000 WATT SWR MOD.PROBLEM?

Stellasstillarat

Active Member
Aug 14, 2014
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2015-04-21 00.00.55.png 2015-04-21 00.00.55.png I use two different meters. One for my am station and the other for my ssb. There both workman. the one I use for SSB is 1000 watts max and works fine in both PEP and average. The other is a 5000 watt max and seems extremely tight in the pep compared to the (1000 watt) one I use for SSB. I don't know the model numbers but the 5000 has a single wattage selector knob. Turning the knob to the right is pep and to the left is avrage. I switched up the am station too the 1000 watt meter and in the 10 watt selector swings to the point where I have switch to the 100 watt position where it hits 18 watts. On the 5000 watt meter it doesn't swing past 5 watts. Both meters read the same when using the modulation and swr sections of the meters. I also hooked up an old microna and got 18 watts upward in the 10 through 100 position. My understanding of the way external meters work is zip but is it possible the problem can be corrected by replacing the transistor or whatever determines the meters correct output reading? I've added a picture of the meter in question. Maybe someone's familiar with it and can tell me if thay have had a similar issue.
 

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Clear something for me. Is it just the PEP thats reading low or does it read carrier low as well? In other words are you talking swing or deadkey? There will be trimpots inside the meter for re-calibrating.If its just the pep thts reading low, that's a whole other ball game dont touch the trimpots.
 
Not familiar with those models. Do you have to power up the meter to read PEP? If you dont then they dont have an active PEP circuit( no transistors or ics) and wont read PEP very accurate anyway.
 
Sorry for leaving that point out as it's obviously important. Dead keys reading the same on all three of my meters. The workman 5000 isn't working correctly on the pep measurement . The radio I use with that meter is a sonar fs2340(bypassed audio clipper) with a stock D104 and demco modulator at the 11 o'clock position. It dead key's at 2 1/2 watt and swings to 18 on the 1000 watt workman and the microna. On the 5000 workman it also dead key's at 2 1/2 but only swings to 5 watts. Thanks
Clear something for me. Is it just the PEP thats reading low or does it read carrier low as well? In other words are you talking swing or deadkey? There will be trimpots inside the meter for re-calibrating.If its just the pep thts reading low, that's a whole other ball game dont touch the trimpots.
 
I'm talking upward swing when I modulate. The workman 5000 is the only one out of the three that's not swinging to 18 watts when I modulate. From the 2 1/2 dead key it stops dead at 5 watts when I modulate.
Clear something for me. Is it just the PEP thats reading low or does it read carrier low as well? In other words are you talking swing or deadkey? There will be trimpots inside the meter for re-calibrating.If its just the pep thts reading low, that's a whole other ball game dont touch the trimpots.
 
I'm talking upward swing when I modulate. The workman 5000 is the only one out of the three that's not swinging to 18 watts when I modulate. From the 2 1/2 dead key it stops dead at 5 watts when I modulate.

Right, you've been asked a very important question you've not answered. Does the meter with PEP need a power supply? This is extremely important because to read PEP properly you need to use a powered meter with an active circuit to hold the meter at the peak value because peak output power on SSB/AM when talking lasts only milliseconds and the meters cannot react that fast enough hence we use a powered circuit with an op amp in order to move the meter to the peak reading and hold it there longer.

If it isn't powered, ie it'll show PEP without 12V or whatever being supplied to the meter, then it isn't showing true PEP and the value it will show is entirely dependent on the how fast the movement on the meter being used reacts and not only will vary from one manufacturer of meter to another but can vary from meter to meter.

The only way to use the unpowered PEP meters to measure peak output is to feed a constant tone into the microphone.

Watch and learn.

 
  • No power supply needed nor is it an option. Thanks for the video. Both the 1000 and microna give me the same readings on swr, power and modulation. I'm sure there not 100% the same but measurements are negleagable. The reading in question is taken on the workman 5000 with the selector knob turned to the pep side (10 watt setting). It's reading AM output as it's hooked up to a sonar fs2340. The 5000 reads 21/2 watts dead key and swings to 5 watts while the 1000 and microna show the same 21/2 watts dead key but peg the neddle on the ten watt scale when I modulate. Switching the selector knob on the workman 1000 and microna to the 100 watt position shows 18 watts total swing on both those meters whilè the workman 5000 reads the same 21/2 dead key it only swings to 5 watts when modulation is added. I like the large lighted meters on the 5000 but unless i get it to work properly (swing wise) I'm gonna leave the almost
    Right, you've been asked a very important question you've not answered. Does the meter with PEP need a power supply? This is extremely important because to read PEP properly you need to use a powered meter with an active circuit to hold the meter at the peak value because peak output power on SSB/AM when talking lasts only milliseconds and the meters cannot react that fast enough hence we use a powered circuit with an op amp in order to move the meter to the peak reading and hold it there longer.
If it isn't powered, ie it'll show PEP without 12V or whatever being supplied to the meter, then it isn't showing true PEP and the value it will show is entirely dependent on the how fast the movement on the meter being used reacts and not only will vary from one manufacturer of meter to another but can vary from meter to meter.

The only way to use the unpowered PEP meters to measure peak output is to feed a constant tone into the microphone.

Watch and learn.

No power supply is needed. The only power supply is the one used to light the three meters. Is plugs into the wall socket and supply 12 volts via an I'm only using it with a sonar fs2340 AM only.cb radio.

Right, you've been asked a very important question you've not answered. Does the meter with PEP need a power supply? This is extremely important because to read PEP properly you need to use a powered meter with an active circuit to hold the meter at the peak value because peak output power on SSB/AM when talking lasts only milliseconds and the meters cannot react that fast enough hence we use a powered circuit with an op amp in order to move the meter to the peak reading and hold it there longer.

If it isn't powered, ie it'll show PEP without 12V or whatever being supplied to the meter, then it isn't showing true PEP and the value it will show is entirely dependent on the how fast the movement on the meter being used reacts and not only will vary from one manufacturer of meter to another but can vary from meter to meter.

The only way to use the unpowered PEP meters to measure peak output is to feed a constant tone into the microphone.

Watch and learn.

 
Ok that helps. this style of meter will switch in a small electro cap to slow the meter movement to give you an indication of PEP.You would be lucky if it was within 20% of the actual output.You could try replacing the cap or changing the value to get it to read the same as your other meters.There may be a resister across the cap and one in series with it to control rise and fall times, these will also change the reading. Check both meters and see if they use the same values , might be the place to start. Really i wouldn't bother ,none of your meters are actually reading PEP .It's just a feel good exercise.
 
Thanks vkrules. I will do exactly that. I know these types of meters are flimsy at best but a reading that may be only 60-70% accurate is better than no reading at all. Thay are consistant which will make me aware of any problems that may occur between my station and antenna. After doing a bit of research I've decided to purchase an m fj 250b. Although the 250b may not be as accurate as a the best digital meter on the market but at $150 can't be beat for the features it offerm the digital display does hold the pep for a full second which is an excellent feature for ssb pep and amplifier tunning. I will post some pictures of the inside of the workman 5000 before and after the repair.if it corrects the problem great. If not it will make an ok back up swr meter. Thanks again. QUOTE="vkrules, post: 518934, member: 24352"]Ok that helps. this style of meter will switch in a small electro cap to slow the meter movement to give you an indication of PEP.You would be lucky if it was within 20% of the actual output.You could try replacing the cap or changing the value to get it to read the same as your other meters.There may be a resister across the cap and one in series with it to control rise and fall times, these will also change the reading. Check both meters and see if they use the same values , might be the place to start. Really i wouldn't bother ,none of your meters are actually reading PEP .It's just a feel good exercise.[/QUOTE]
 


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