Contest rudeness runs international....

[WX2MIG]

I've made no bones about my general disdain for many contester's and their rudeness on the HF bands.
Today I got to experience it on an international level while monitoring the Maritime Mobile Service Net that runs daily on 14.3000.0 Mhz, a contest club station in Slovenia broke in right in the middle of the net and started calling...."CQ Contest, CQ Contest, this S35M...blah...blah...blah...."

No less than 3 stations plus myself attempted to ask this ham to move frequencies, and that he was stepping all over the net, but either he had mud in his ears, or just didn't care because he just kept on going.

He was still calling when I came into the house to look him up and e-mail him as to what he was doing....

Now I realize Slovenia is in a different hemisphere, and the Maritime Mobile Service Net does not serve his general area of the world, but let's face it, the net has been an established function on 14.300.0 Mhz since 1968, everybody and their mother knows about it, what it does, who it serves, when it's on, and where it's on, a contest is no substitute for good operating practice, and to dial in on a frequency that has a long time established net that serves the purpose the MMSN does is just another prime example of how contests suck the soul out of amateur radio, and on an international scale....

Disclaimer....
I know and I'am well aware that all who actively participate in contests are not bad or rude operators, some are top notch people, but you all have to admit that many died in the wool contest hounds are some of the lowest forms of amateur radio life. No better than those DX hounds that would step on their own mother's back to get a country they never worked before.....

Sorry, but this one really rubbed me the wrong way, and I needed to vent.....

 

[hookedon6]

sooooooo, find out what organization was sponsoring the 'test.

read the contest rules.

make a protest and get the LID DQ'ed

its (at least) 4 stations against one

 

[WX2MIG]

It's a lot more than 4 stations Hookedon6, the Maritime Mobile Service Net is one of the largest, and longest running nets on the 20 meter band, they serve from the eastern Pacific, to the western Atlantic, Gulf of Mexico, and Caribbean Sea. It operates from 16:00 UTC to 01:00 UTC Monday to Friday, 17:00 UTC to 21:00 UTC on Saturday, 52 weeks a year. The number of check-in's and those who monitor can run well over a hundred at any given time.

I have no doubt this operator from Slovenia got under the skin of more ham's than me or the other 3 stations that politely requested he move frequencies.

Giving this guy the benefit of doubt, the band has been quite flat lately, and it is possible that he was just not hearing us, but he still tried to utilize a frequency well known to most general class and above amateur's to be one that is off limits during those hours, and he was calling CQ Contest, and not just CQ, so it's pretty safe to assume he was looking for contacts outside of Europe.....

It's hard to believe that with the strength he was hitting me, that he could not hear me respond, again giving him the benefit of doubt, I'am running barefoot through a wire, but the other 3 guys swung their beams around and had their amps on, so even if I didn't make it above his noise level, I know the other signals had to be bending the needle on his "S" meter.....

After sending him an e-mail, and posting about it here, I returned to the shack and he was gone, so either the propagation changed, or he got the message......

 

[Hutch]

As you indicated that he continued on and didn't engage any of the other stations attempting to call him, there is the possibility that although you could hear him he couldn't hear you. That is a reality that many seem to forget in the HF bands, everyone that interrupts might not be doing it on purpose.

As for the frequency being off limits, well there is no such thing, no net (or individual) can claim ownership of a frequency. Yes it is a common convention and courtesy that most steer clear of these frequencies and the knowledge of these frequencies might not be the same in other parts of the world. So rather than get upset by this you might want to look at from another perspective.

Now had he responded and continued then I would call that rudeness. Without knowing if he heard you or the others I would give him the benefit the doubt.

 

[W5LZ]

No one 'owns' a frequency, that's true. But, by the same token (and rule), no one may interfere on a busy frequency intentionally. Remember about that old thingy about listening before transmitting? That typically means longer than one or two seconds.

I have a definite prejudice against contesters. I do know that there are exceptions, but the general 'run of the mill' contester cares about making a contact, nothing else. In my opinion, they rank right up there with politicians, and I can't think of anything worse to call someone, in general. If you happen to be one of those exceptional contesters that doesn't interfere intentionally, be well and prosper. If you're the other kind, I've already said what I think of you.
- 'Doc

 

[Hutch]

Lets use some common sense here, if there is a busy net going on on a frequency, do you think that would be a good place for a contester to pick up contacts?

I think my post made it very clear there doesn't seem to be any indication that he was "knowingly" interfering, form the information that was provided. You can listen all day long if you can't hear them that doesn't mean much. Just because you can hear someone doesn't mean they can hear you.

Well I'm not a contester at all, I also don't get all bent out of shape by the bad things that others do, I concern my self with my conduct not that of others which I can't control (I'm not nor do I want to be the band police).

I've been an amateur for almost 20 years and participated in maybe two contests, in the very early 90's with my local club (actually had a very good time sort of like field day).

 

[W5LZ]

Ah, but what about those 'split' operations? Aren't they just great? One station, typically out of the USA phone band calling and then 'listening' on a fairly wide range of frequencies higher in the USA phone band. Never checks to see if there are busy frequencies in that 'range'. And then the idiot who also doesn't listen to see if the frequency is busy before immediately, and repeatedly giving their call sign. If there's just one of those 'idiots' and not several dozen of them, you are very lucky. Makes no difference what/who is already occupying that frequency. "I didn't hear anyone when I listened!"... sure, pure horse 'hockey'. Is that 'DX' station liable for someone else's illegal operation? No, but he's dam well responsible for it, isn't he. It amounts to very poor operating habits, and should be treated as such by those running the contest. Ever see that happen? No, you haven't, and I doubt seriously if you ever will. I'm afraid that as far as I'm concerned, it's open season on contesters.
- 'Doc

 

[hookedon6]

ISTHEFREQUENCYINUSECQCQCQTEST......:headbang

 

[Hutch]

Ah, but what about those 'split' operations? Aren't they just great? One station, typically out of the USA phone band calling and then 'listening' on a fairly wide range of frequencies higher in the USA phone band. Never checks to see if there are busy frequencies in that 'range'. And then the idiot who also doesn't listen to see if the frequency is busy before immediately, and repeatedly giving their call sign. If there's just one of those 'idiots' and not several dozen of them, you are very lucky. Makes no difference what/who is already occupying that frequency. "I didn't hear anyone when I listened!"... sure, pure horse 'hockey'. Is that 'DX' station liable for someone else's illegal operation? No, but he's dam well responsible for it, isn't he. It amounts to very poor operating habits, and should be treated as such by those running the contest. Ever see that happen? No, you haven't, and I doubt seriously if you ever will. I'm afraid that as far as I'm concerned, it's open season on contesters.
- 'Doc

Contesters aren't the only ones being rude and using poor operating practices.

What does "open season on contesters" mean, is this another one of "you will match their bad operating with that of your own"? The bands would be so much better if everyone just grew up, cut some slack and stopped acting like they own the bands and playing policeman. Many also must realize that not everyone in the world has the same rules and restrictions as those in the US, the amateur bands don't belong to the US.

If the bands are too filled with contesters, I find somewhere else to go, if there's no where else I find something else to do, there's more to life than radio, and I'm not going to get all worked up by a bunch of lids on the radio or internet for that matter.

 

[hookedon6]

CB CB CB 'TEST

Lets use some common sense here, if there is a busy net going on on a frequency, do you think that would be a good place for a contester to pick up contacts?

well, no i don't. but i have had LID contestors come up on MY freq (read: in use) and then bitch about my QRM.

at that point, i usually point my antenna AT them (no i don't try to null them out of my receiver) and then go QRO. most of the time they get the hint

 

[WX2MIG]

Contesters aren't the only ones being rude and using poor operating practices.

What does "open season on contesters" mean, is this another one of "you will match their bad operating with that of your own"? The bands would be so much better if everyone just grew up, cut some slack and stopped acting like they own the bands and playing policeman. Many also must realize that not everyone in the world has the same rules and restrictions as those in the US, the amateur bands don't belong to the US.

If the bands are too filled with contesters, I find somewhere else to go, if there's no where else I find something else to do, there's more to life than radio, and I'm not going to get all worked up by a bunch of lids on the radio or internet for that matter.

Hutch....
your argument is a valid one, and also the same perspective shared by many, however as with all things, there are two ways of looking at it, and as much as your points make sense, I also agree with Doc.
I have committed a lot of time and hard earned money so that I too may enjoy amateur radio. Like many working people, sometimes the weekends are the only times I can enjoy this hobby, and it does become frustrating when you get some time to play radio, and every band you have access to is cluttered with contester's. All they want is your call sign, signal report, then get off my frequency, the whole concept of making radio a competition sucks the very soul out of the intended nature of the hobby, and that's communicating with, and spreading good will among all other amateur radio operators around the world.
It wouldn't be so bad if there were only a small handful of contests per year, and their activities were confined to one or two bands, or small segments of all the bands, but it's not like that. There seems to be a contest almost every weekend during the winter months when there really is nothing else to do for those of us living in the northern climates. It's too damn cold to go surfing, target shooting, fishing, there's no yard work needed to be done yet, the winter cover is still on the swimming pool and bar-b-que grill, you go out to the ham shack, turn on your radio, and there's few if any band space open for you to strike up a good old fashion rag chew because damn near every available frequency has some guy calling CQ Contest, CQ Contest, and if you do answer their call, don't dare ask them how the weather is where they are from, you probably won't like the answer you get......

I accept the fact that contests have become an ingrained aspect of amateur radio, but the whole contest thing has grown out of control, it has bred a whole group of rude, self absorbed, ignorant radio operators that could care less how bad their operating skills are, as long as they get the contacts they need to earn yet another piece of paper to hang on their wall. The split frequency thing that Doc pointed out is something that should be ruled out completely, not only in contests, but also for Dexpeditions, and field day operations, the bandwith taken away from everyone else by this practice is ridiculous, and very unfair.

Now the main point of what I was trying to convey about this one particular incident is the fact that The long established Intercon Net, The Maritime Mobile Service Net, The Pacific Seafarers Net, and the U.S.C.G. Amateur Radio Club Net have all worked together in containing all of their public service functions to "ONE" frequency (14.300 Mhz). For over 30 years these organizations have worked out net schedules so they could all work within that frequency, and not tie up a huge chunk of 20 meter bandwith, and for over 30 years they have contained all their activities to 14.300 Mhz. They all have websites that are linked together forming the 14.300 net frequency group. Let's face it, it's no secret to anyone, no matter where in the world you are that at almost any time during the 24 hour cycle, there's something already going on at 14.300.....unless you happen to be a contest jockey that just doesn't give a damn about anything but the number of quick contacts you can pile up towards that piece of wall paper to hang up in your shack.....

As I have already stated in previous post, I 'am willing to give this guy the benefit of doubt on a few points, but anyone who has spent any time on 20 meters, in any part of the world, has got to know about the stream of public service activities being conducted on 14.300 Mhz, so whether you agree with me or not, this clown gets a penalty flag......

 

[Peddler]

And they say 11 meters is rude Rave on...:thumbdown: