So now what?

[bcrewcaptain]

I guess it's time to upgrade the antenna to extend my chat time a bit.
Haven't even had an HF rig for 2 months, got bit by the DX bug and here I am with a conversation around the world, literally, talked to a fellow in Perth a few minutes ago, who got me on the"short side" and then swung his beam around to catch me on the long side.
11530 miles the short way, 13326 if you take the long path.
I guess I can mention that to those that sweat that "antenna is everything" since it was done with a PL-259 and 15' of 15yr old speaker wire for a dipole slid inside some PVC pipe, 15' off the ground.

A happy DX day for Jeff....

 

[w9cll]

Two words....Hex Beam! I will be putting a 5 band one up this summer.

 

[wavrider]

I guess it's time to upgrade the antenna to extend my chat time a bit.
Haven't even had an HF rig for 2 months, got bit by the DX bug and here I am with a conversation around the world, literally, talked to a fellow in Perth a few minutes ago, who got me on the"short side" and then swung his beam around to catch me on the long side.
11530 miles the short way, 13326 if you take the long path.
I guess I can mention that to those that sweat that "antenna is everything" since it was done with a PL-259 and 15' of 15yr old speaker wire for a dipole slid inside some PVC pipe, 15' off the ground.

A happy DX day for Jeff....

Not to bust your bubble, but you did mention that the OP in Perth had to swing his beam around to make the contact with a stronger signal.

So it was the op in Perths antenna that was doing all the work

So yes antenna antenna antenna does make all the difference.

 

[hookedon6]

Not to bust your bubble, but you did mention that the OP in Perth had to swing his beam around to make the contact with a stronger signal...

gee,..... where did he say that?

 

[RatsoW8]

Not to bust your bubble, but you did mention that the OP in Perth had to swing his beam around to make the contact with a stronger signal.

So it was the op in Perths antenna that was doing all the work

So yes antenna antenna antenna does make all the difference.

Actually propagation is doing most of the work. Yagis and good receivers help improve reception of a signal but the signal has to be there in the first place to be heard and Jeff's was

I've used dipoles and yagis and I've always been more excited about the contacts I've made using low power and low hanging homebrew frakentennas.

 

[bcrewcaptain]

Not to bust your bubble, but you did mention that the OP in Perth had to swing his beam around to make the contact with a stronger signal.

So it was the op in Perths antenna that was doing all the work

So yes antenna antenna antenna does make all the difference.

I don't recall saying that part, however I was communicating with 2 stations (VK6IR and VK6TQ) that were relatively close to each other(40 miles).
One had a beam, one didn't, the operator with the beam wanted to see if I could be reached both long and short ways, in this case, my signal report was the same. Both stations were getting a 5/7-5/8 from me.

Sure a good antenna will increase the chances, as will firing up the KW box. Condx and timing I have found are far more important in this case.

My point being is...I have under $10 invested in an antenna that made it around the world with a $400 radio.

THAT is more of an accomplishment to me than the guy with the $4k radio, the banks of tuners and eqs, the 125' tower and the $3k SteipIr bolted on top.
I think the comment from the guys last night were something along of the lines of"speaker wire, pvc pipe and less than 30' off the ground? why did I buy all this crap?"

 

[w9cll]

My point being is...I have under $10 invested in an antenna that made it around the world with a $400 radio.

THAT is more of an accomplishment to me than the guy with the $4k radio, the banks of tuners and eqs, the 125' tower and the $3k SteipIr bolted on top.
I think the comment from the guys last night were something along of the lines of"speaker wire, pvc pipe and less than 30' off the ground? why did I buy all this crap?"

Amen, I agree totally.

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

When conditions are good they are good. I once worked 3B9C on Rodrigues Island via longpath. 15,000 miles with 100 watts on a Hamstick while mobile. having accomplished that I still maintain that the antenna is everything. Doing something once or twice does make a trend nor prove anything. Every now and then I get a pleasant surprise by accomplishing a DX feat with next to nothing however I would not want to run next to nothing all the time.

 

[bcrewcaptain]

which pretty much reinforces my point, why dump more money into a setup that works. I'm on a budget, I know I can reach that far with parts I had in a wal-mart bag in the garage. I didn't even need to climb my tower to do it, and I can make another antenna for every band if needed and still get change back from a $20.

 

[wavrider]

gee,..... where did he say that?

Your correct post did not say stronger, it said short and long.

With that said.

Lets look at REAL WORLD comparisons.

From my QTH here in N florida to OP in New Mexico.

Using the yagi four active elements on 10 meters 55' AGL. I was a 5-9+ to New Mexico, 100 watts. OP was 5-7 on my receive.

Co phased Delta loops at 40 feet I was 5-7 to New Mexico op was 5-5 in my receive. Same 100 watts.

Imax 2000 at 65' I was 5-8 to New Mexico 100 watts, OP was 5-7 in my receive.

So there is YAGI, WIRE, and Vertical all compared in a 10 minute QSO.

OP in New Mexico was using an 80 meter ladder line fed doublet with the legs running East-West. He was lumping a heck of a signal off the end of that wire.

Is it antenna or conditions? Of course it is conditions, but it does help to have a good gain directional antenna, If you can not hear then you can not work them.

I have been on both sides of the fence, I have taken down all the yagis for maintenance and just used wires for antennas.

I can hear and I can make contacts but I did find myself turning the amp on a lot more using the wires to bust through a pile up. Where as with the yagi it was usually 100 watts and that was all that was needed to bust the pile up.

What it comes down to is get the best antenna you can up in the air as high as you safely can and have fun making contacts.

Wires are fun to play with and I enjoy that a lot.

A moxon is hard to beat for a few feet of wire you get gain and rejection.

A 1/2 wl dipole or a 1/4 wl vertical are good antennas, there are better antennas but then it becomes a compromise as to gain VS rejection and band width etc etc

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

which pretty much reinforces my point, why dump more money into a setup that works. I'm on a budget, I know I can reach that far with parts I had in a wal-mart bag in the garage. I didn't even need to climb my tower to do it, and I can make another antenna for every band if needed and still get change back from a $20.

No my previous post does not reinforce your point.Works is relative. I said it can be done but it is usually not done. It depends on what you want to accomplish and are satisfied with. If using an antenna 15 feet off the ground and working X-number of countries/contacts is your cup of tea then fine. Putting up a better antenna at even minimal cost and being able to work 10 X the DX is a real eye opener.

 

[bcrewcaptain]

No my previous post does not reinforce your point.Works is relative. I said it can be done but it is usually not done. It depends on what you want to accomplish and are satisfied with. If using an antenna 15 feet off the ground and working X-number of countries/contacts is your cup of tea then fine. Putting up a better antenna at even minimal cost and being able to work 10 X the DX is a real eye opener.

I think everyone has their idea of "minimal" cost. I live in a heavily wooded area with no room to swing a beam, my options(without trimming trees and increasing cost are to go higher, or go longer. I have a mutiband antenna which is much longer, that would be at vitually the same height, with slightly better RX, TX is comparable.
I went the high dollar route in the 11M days, so I'm well aware what is capable in this frequency range.
10X the DX would not happen in this location even after spending 10X the dollars.
If I want to play on big $ radios, I can go down the road and play with a locals antenna farm with multi element beams on 100' towers, hooked to all the contest rigs and all the Ameritron power you can shove in the shack.

Or I can just wait patiently with my crappy little dipole and "get lucky" by being patient.
Was last night a fluke? You never know, but it worked on 2 completely different stations, and about 40 other countries in the last couple months a few minutes at a time, so I guess it's a start. Either that or I'm just that darn lucky

 

[Captain Kilowatt]

I am not even talking yagis. Get the same antenna up a lot higher than 15 feet and see the difference. You say you have trees? Use them to your advantage. String that dipole up in the tree tops. It does not have to be in the wide open spaces. The only extra cost is a few feet of coax and some rope. That is indeed minimal cost in anyone's book.

 

[bcrewcaptain]

Height makes some difference, but not a tremendous amount given the fact I'm tucked at the foothills of the blue ridge mountains, My Imax is tuned for 10m with the base at about 85', I have a pulley system where I can drop that down and simply suspend this in the middle, from the tests I have done at least, not enough trouble to flip the location on the 2 antennas, unfortunately I'm in a bit of a hole and surrounded to my immediate west by mtns with 2200' change in elevation. I have antennas and pulleys strung all over this place for a variety of setups, but this is what I ended up with as I have a duplicate that clips to the side of the camper when I don't bring the Imax.

I think next will be to build a duplicate for 6m and see how it does. For the price, I'm not exactly out much.Or anything in this case.