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TS590 Any solutions yet?

G

gs-radio

Member
Oct 23, 2013
12
0
11
Hi,
I am looking around for an hf radio which will also allow 2m and 4m operation via a transverter.

Leaving aside the shacks in a box type the TS590S seems to be a very good option, particularly the receiver.

My main concern has always been the low average ssb power which I know is a major problem having used a friends radio, and the countless reviews.
Also to a lesser extent is the power spike or overshoot.

Are there any recent fixes for these problems or have these issues reduced in more recent models?
Also, does anyone have any experience of using a tvtr which the 590?

73s
 

Here is a good read on setting up the TX audio for the 590. I have used this and it works. I also have an oscilloscope monitoring my TX output/audio, so I can verify proper operation. Note that the "power meter" in the 590 does NOT read PEP, it reads average power. I have not noted any power spikes on initial PTT as verified on the 'scope. The 'scope also verifies full 100W PEP power output.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/wadei/TS-590S_HOWTO_ssb_audio_setup_v1.0.pdf
 
Thanks for the replies, and I have to admit the page written by Ian Wade is an excellent piece of work with a huge amount of sensible information. However he primarily deals with the audio quality setup which is certainly a major plus with this rig and he describes the settings very well.

My concern is not regarding the audio quality but the average talk power or probably a better way of putting it the PAR power to average ratio.

A PEP meter will accurately show the 100 watts pep which the TS590S produces, however by using a pep meter you are heavily disguising the very low average talk power.

An interesting way of checking the average talk power on a normal meter is simply by comparing it with other rigs. For example on the same meter testing an FT847, IC706, FT1000 etc etc will show a much higher average power level, although on a pep meter they will be very similar.

I wouldn't bother or read the internal power meter on the rig or any rig for that matter. All they serve to tell you is that 'smoke is going up the chimney' they really have little other use.

I was (and still am) hoping that someone will comment that the latest batch of TS590s have the problem resolved.
 
Mine is over a year old. I have full output on all modes. My transmit audio receives decent reports. The receive section is right up there.

This rig sees heavy CW use. The available options for this mode make me happy.

I realize my comments aren't scientific, but it doesn't need to be. It's a nice rig and I like it.

Lol,

I like to buy, try and sell...

This is the longest I've let any rig sit on my desk. It might be a keeper.

Plus, it's a sexy looking rig.
 
gs-radio said:
My main concern has always been the low average ssb power which I know is a major problem having used a friends radio, and the countless reviews.
Also to a lesser extent is the power spike or overshoot.
Click to expand...

There is no problem with low average SSB output, just a long line of idiots using the wrong measuring equipment.

All modern solid state transceivers have a power spike/ALC overshoot.
 
gs-radio said:
For example on the same meter testing an FT847, IC706, FT1000 etc etc will show a much higher average power level, although on a pep meter they will be very similar.
Click to expand...

No it won't. I've done this test with a FT1000, FT950, TS480 and Icom 7000.

Here's the FT1000 vs TS590 comparison

TS590 vs FT1000 MKV Field SSB Talk Power - YouTube

And if you also look at the following video I did for a FT950 and compare that with the readings for the TS590 for the one above you'll see they're the same...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NN-fGzCglZI

I
 
M0GVZ said:
There is no problem with low average SSB output, just a long line of idiots using the wrong measuring equipment.

All modern solid state transceivers have a power spike/ALC overshoot.
Click to expand...

Just had a look at the videos you have linked to thanks.

It's a bit difficult to read your power meter with the resolution I have but it looks like around 15w average for the 590 and approx. 20w on the FT1000.

What surprises me is that I use an FT1000mp here and my average is approx 50w, considerably more than yours is delivering. I'm not sure why you have only 20w but it may be mic or other audio settings. Certainly a huge discrepancy with my equipment though. Also if I talk the mp higher the power will increase above 50w, something the 590 will only achieve through a whistle or similar high freq injection. OK, I haven't videos to prove my readings but I can assure you the 590 was much lower than other equipment tested.

If I had a rig claiming to run 100 pep ssb I would be very unhappy if it averaged 10-15w.

Just to answer your point about idiots using the wrong measuring equipment If the same measuring equipment and patch leads are compared across different equipment it really shouldn't matter, it's the comparison that is important. I think there are quite a few amateurs out there who have carried out serious tests and I know they are far from 'idiots'.

btw - You are incorrect, not all modern solid state transceivers have a power spike/ALC overshoot.


Having said that I thank you for posting the videos.
 
gs-radio said:
What surprises me is that I use an FT1000mp here and my average is approx 50w, considerably more than yours is delivering. I'm not sure why you have only 20w but it may be mic or other audio settings.
Click to expand...
Meters are mechanical and depending on the damping of the needle either caused by the circuitry connected to the meter or the meter itself you'll get different responses. That is why anything but PEP is meaningless for measuring SSB.

Certainly a huge discrepancy with my equipment though. Also if I talk the mp higher the power will increase above 50w,
Click to expand...
If it is then you haven't set up the mic gain properly or the ALC is faulty.

something the 590 will only achieve through a whistle or similar high freq injection.
Click to expand...
Which is how every radio I've owned has been.
If I had a rig claiming to run 100 pep ssb I would be very unhappy if it averaged 10-15w.
Click to expand...
What it reads is dependent on the speed of the needle which is why using anything other than PEP is meaningless.

btw - You are incorrect, not all modern solid state transceivers have a power spike/ALC overshoot.
Click to expand...

Sorry but you're wrong on that. They all do, every single one of them, to one extent or another. Here's an excerpt from http://www.va3cr.net/mods/FL7000ProtectLight.mod.htm

"3.In the case of FT1000D, improper adjustment of DRIVE level, when not adjusted properly, there is a high power spike witch is detected by FL7000 protection."

"I did have problems with other exciters as Drake TR7 and Omni V ( not in QSK ) they have the big spike at first TX."

Also from the comments here about the Alpha 87A amp: http://asktheham.com/node/44

"This is a common flaw in many radios, and I have first hand observation of it occurring in the K3, FT-897, IC-706, IC-718, and IC-7000. Many hams will tell you that these radios NEVER output a power spike, but they are simply thinking with love of the radio instead of facts."
 

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