At this point in time - Antenna experiences so far

[Needle Bender]

NB, what happened to your testing idea where you were going to prove beyond all doubt that the Vector does not radiate from the bottom radial cone?

Have you ever used your testing idea to prove the bottom of the Vector doesn't radiate on your Penetrator. 5/8 waves are commonly said not to radiate from the bottom 1/8 wave due to cancellation. If your test can prove that effectively and you can demonstrate it on a video using your Penetrator, then the Vector results might be a lot more reliable in the minds of those that believe differently, assuming that you are right of course.

Its been a while now, what's the delay?

IMO, the GM is void of TVI type problems at my location, it's very broad banded, easy to install, and has a very small foot print. As far as the gain compared to my other CB vertical antennas, it's about as good as any of the others I have.

How say you?

The local friend who thought he might have a gamma & bracket couldn't find it, so I'll need one for 4 radials, though I'd make due with one for 3 if necessary.
Mine is cheap pot metal and broken where the tab protrudes out for the gamma connector mounting.

We discussed the current meter idea, but the light is not showing what I had hoped with regard to the current node, so I'll have to make a current meter.

I wouldn't imagine the Penetrator bottom 1/8 wave cancels the next one up until several feet away from the antenna where the two radiated inverse 1/8 waves can blend and cancel.

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

you can make a hub for the base using 3/4 or 1 inch by 1/16 inch aluminum strip and good quality hose clamps .

rather than have the ends that attach to the vertical going up ..... have them going down . make a 5th that's just L shaped for your feedpoint/gamma attachment ...... mobile stud mounts work great .

 

[Marconi]

The local friend who thought he might have a gamma & bracket couldn't find it, so I'll need one for 4 radials, though I'd make due with one for 3 if necessary.

Mine is cheap pot metal and broken where the tab protrudes out for the gamma connector mounting.

We discussed the current meter idea, but the light is not showing what I had hoped with regard to the current node, so I'll have to make a current meter.

I wouldn't imagine the Penetrator bottom 1/8 wave cancels the next one up until several feet away from the antenna where the two radiated inverse 1/8 waves can blend and cancel.

Well I looked for my Sirio hub and I can't find it. But, since your hub and the radial connectors are OK, just use a coaxial pig tail to feed the gamma match like Joe Gunn uses, and forget about the coax connector. No big deal, just keep them short and account a little for the added wire in your antenna length maybe.

I could be wrong, but I don't accept your theory regarding the 1/8 wave canceling out the next higher 1/8 wave too, if that is what you are saying.

 

[Needle Bender]

Well I looked for my Sirio hub and I can't find it. But, since your hub and the radial connectors are OK, just use a coaxial pig tail to feed the gamma match like Joe Gunn uses, and forget about the coax connector. No big deal, just keep them short and account a little for the added wire in your antenna length maybe.

I could be wrong, but I don't accept your theory regarding the 1/8 wave canceling out the next higher 1/8 wave too, if that is what you are saying.

The way mine is broken, the gamma hangs loose and is free floating below the upper connection. There's nothing there to hold it in place, only the radials are solidly in place.

 

[Marconi]

The way mine is broken, the gamma hangs loose and is free floating below the upper connection. There's nothing there to hold it in place, only the radials are solidly in place.

That makes sense. Is your antenna a CTE or a Sirio?

 

[Needle Bender]

It's a 4-radial with an alloy hub up about 20' which then has very puny tubing coming up & out of that hub with a single Allen set screw to hold the top 7-8 feet of 3/8"-5/16" silly small diameter tubing.

Not certain the brand but it was sold to me as a Sigma3/4 - I'm not sure the guy really knew what it was.

I plan to hack off the alloy hub at 20' up, and add a piece of solid aluminum instead, down-drilled from the top down to accept a 102" SS whip in place of the wimpy top tubing.

I don't relish the idea of having to bother my neighbors to allow me to dive to the bottom of their pool to retrieve the top of my antenna. :glare:

 

[Needle Bender]

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[Needle Bender]

Hey NB, is this some sort of lame excuse for not doing the testing you promissed us would prove beyond all doubt that the Vector/Sigma does not radiate from the bottom?

I sent you an email with a video showing some guys doing the test you described. Contrary to what you told me, these guys were able to get the neon light to work at both the current node and the voltage node.

I'm loosing faith in you bud.

No excuses, just the facts, and if I decided not to do the video I won't need some lame excuse, I'll just post that I have changed my mind and am no longer interested.
- What someone, somewhere might maybe possibly tend to imagine about me in the negative really kind of makes no difference to me.

My antenna is broken, I thought I could resurrect the gamma bracket but it's pot metal and won't play fair, that's all.

If I decide it's worth it, I'll have to either fabricate something (like Booty advised) out of some hardware, or if I'm motivated enough, order a new Vector bracket direct from Sirio.

At this point I actually have lost a lot of motivation since I found the light won't show current as I had hoped.

Eddie I didn't get any video or video link from you showing neon light testing but I'd like to see it if you want to post it. Was it a Vector type antenna they were testing?

I'm also thinking about simply dissecting the Sigma-Vector for parts and building the other modded Starduster that was being 'modeled', working it until I get the performance I want, if possible.

But I would like to at least try out the Vector (against the Penetrator & Gainmaster) before cutting it up, especially one like Bob85s if I could ever get measurements so I'd have a grenade-close starting point.

Actually, I'm starting to get a little :bored: with it all right now. Maybe in a week or five I'll get re-motivated.

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

what is the diameter of the lower section of tubing on the vectors and sigmas ?

 

[Marconi]

what is the diameter of the lower section of tubing on the vectors and sigmas ?

My Sigma4 has 1.5" tubing at the bottom. The dimensions that Bob posted for the New Vector 4000 shows 1.456".

NB, here is the link to the light video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-FoHs94JY4

 

[Needle Bender]

Eddie that is a florescent light not neon, and the high voltage node is above the coil, the current node is at the bottom and when I tested with a florescent light with the 1/2 wave Proton I couldn't get it to light at the center where the high current node is, only at the top & bottom high voltage nodes.

If the Vector was radiating current from the cone the florescent light wouldn't show it, it would only show the voltage node at the top & bottom of the upper 1/2 wave, unless you used a very low wattage light while transmitting several hundred watts, then you would probably see it light everywhere within several feet.

That's just the opposite of what I need to see.

Voltage proves little, the current is what would prove radiation but that will need some other means of testing, after I get it up & running with a new gamma/cone radial bracket.

 

[Marconi]

Eddie that is a florescent light not neon, and the high voltage node is above the coil, the current node is at the bottom and when I tested with a florescent light with the 1/2 wave Proton I couldn't get it to light at the center where the high current node is, only at the top & bottom high voltage nodes.

If the Vector was radiating current from the cone the florescent light wouldn't show it, it would only show the voltage node at the top & bottom of the upper 1/2 wave, unless you used a very low wattage light while transmitting several hundred watts, then you would probably see it light everywhere within several feet.

That's just the opposite of what I need to see.

Voltage proves little, the current is what would prove radiation but that will need some other means of testing, after I get it up & running with a new gamma/cone radial bracket.

You're right it is not neon.{Cry_river}
I saw the same thing, but if you look closely you'll see that they did the same thing with the Wilson type magnet mount on the van. Check at about 1.48 minutes into the video, where they got similar results off of the Wilson with the light near the bottom of the radiator.

Are you saying the bottom of the Wilson antenna is a high voltage node, and that is why we see the light shining there also?

Can you explain that?

 

[BOOTY MONSTER]

Are you saying the bottom of the Wilson antenna is a high voltage node, and that is why we see the light shining there also?

Can you explain that?

could it simply be because there is more antenna/length at the coil for the signal to radiate of off .... and that why coils higher up the antenna can perform better ?

 

[Marconi]

could it simply be because there is more antenna/length at the coil for the signal to radiate of off .... and that why coils higher up the antenna can perform better ?

If I understand you're exact point BM, I would tend to think like inductive coil theory suggest, that the inductor tends to raise the current a bit higher up the radiator, and that is why the radiator may perform a tad better, but again...like I tend to say so often, "...how much difference does it make."

In this case, looking at some current distribution tabular values on various antennas and some with coils, I see very little difference ascribed to the ideas noted in the use of these big coils near the middle of a mobile radiator. However, the current response does tend to follow the rule.

If this is not what you have in mind, let me know, and tell me more as to what is on your mind.

 

[Needle Bender]

Consider the Wilson is a loaded shortened 1/4 wave, the whip being a little over 5', the coil then has to make up for the missing 4' and they are holding it to the whip a few inches above the coil so imagine a 9' whip with a 2-pill amp driving into it (Do we even know how much power they were running? 350HD? 667?) and you are holding a 40w bulb and what looks like my 8w aquarium bulb, 4' up the whip, you should see light.

Like I stated, with enough power you might generate a high enough RF field to light it just about anywhere, but at the bottom of a 102" SS whip you won't get it to light if you use about the same power bulb and transmitter, then you'll only see it light well above the center because the current is at the bottom, the voltage at the top.

In a 1/2 wave it's a mirror image of the 102" whip - beneath it.
High current in the middle, high voltage at the top & bottom.

You won't even get an 8w bulb to light even though you run 50w, if you hold it to the middle of an Antron99 or Proton, but drop the power to around 10w and it will light near the top, and near the bottom especially if you have a choke wrapped right below it in the coax.