Siro 5000 vs Wilson 1000... The results

[The Mad Scientist]

I beg to differ with your statement. You DO NOT NEED a tri-mag to run the sirio p5000 series antennas. I have been using the turbo 5000 on my full sized truck for almost a year and I have personally tested it to +80 miles an hour and it holds fast with the sirio mag. I have also occasionally hit overhead objects with it and it never moved or deformed the whip in any way. And as far as it being worth using, just from the physical aspects of it alone makes it worth it. However having said this, The true test of this antenna will have to be seen as the years pass to see what the longitivity of the antenna will be.

I would recommend hardmounting the antenna to acheave the most of the antenna's noise reduction ability. But it can be run with the sirio mag with good results as well.

the mag is totally sealed to prevent corrosion, while the Wilson's is not.

The sirio's electrical length is a true 108" while the wilson's is around 101"and change.

The antenns has an overall lower swr than the Wilson in my experence.

Cbradiomagazine....The coax on the sirio mag can be easyily changed to a better grade. I changed the coax on the one I use to the LMR200 ultraflex and used the formula to come up with the correct length for the band I am using. It works very well.

Not really sure how looks come into the evaluation? That aspect is a personal taste to the individual. But when you are looking for a good antenna you tend to go with with what works rather than looks. For me I happen to like the look of the antenna with it's slim profile. I find the look quite refreshing as compared to the same ole stuff that we have here in the us.

2RT307......

I was sceptical as most people were until I tried it. I was a die hard Wilson fan untill I came across the sirio's. seen an immeadiate improvement over the Wilson. I liked it so much that I bought a second one for my wife's ride. Try it...you won't regret it.


I still have the wilson 5000 and a brand new trucker 5000 that I can't even give away...LOL

 

[W5LZ]

"The coax on the sirio mag can be easyily changed to a better grade. I changed the coax on the one I use to the LMR200 ultraflex and used the formula to come up with the correct length for the band I am using. It works very well."

It sounds like you are saying that the feed line is being used for impedance matching, is that right? No idea what formula you would need if that isn't the case.
- 'Doc

 

[The DB]

Cbradiomagazine....The coax on the sirio mag can be easyily changed to a better grade. I changed the coax on the one I use to the LMR200 ultraflex and used the formula to come up with the correct length for the band I am using. It works very well.

What formula are you talking about?

If you replaced 50Ω coax with 50Ω coax, and the original 50Ω coax was not used for matching purposes on a feedline with another impedance, any length would work.

Every mobile CB antenna I have ever seen only used 50Ω coax.

Also, I have on multiple occasions replaced the feedline on both Wilson 1000's and 5000's. I've used RG-8/x, RG-213, and LMR-400. I had to drill out the hole the feedline entered through, but aside from that have never had an issue. I typically used an electrical ½λ for tuning purposes, but any other length used in mobile applications would work just as well.


The DB

 

[cbradiomagazine.com]

I think looks play a huge part in choosing an antenna for the majority of people who aren't die hard radio nerds like us

The Wilson 5000 mag mount has a much lower profile look than the Sirio 5000 mag mount setup on top of the roof of a car. Now if you currently have an antenna off the bed of your pickup or a fender mount or something the Sirio might not stand out as much comparitively but in the original scenario I mentioned the Sirio is taller, is silver and blue and stands out quite a bit more than the black wilson.

Of course like most antennas as a driver I usually forget about it within a week or so. It's only when I drive by cars and see that people have confused looks on their faces as they look at my roof do I remember that I have a big antenna on top and my vehicle looks like a RC toy.

But either the Wilson 5000 or Sirio 5000 is much less noticeable than the predator 10 K on the roof

Performance wise you might see 1 S unit difference in testing with locals. With the amp on I didn't notice a whole of difference but when talking DX barefoot I consistently found it easier to make contacts with the Sirio. This is over months of testing switching back and forth. It's very subjective of course and non-scientific.

Regardless of the slight increase in performance I found that this antenna tuned more easily than the Wilson 5000 and it also tuned for a better SWR and was more broadbanded. All good things.

I've used Wilson 5000's for years and recommended them pretty heavily and they are still a great antenna (although I did have one of mine develop an issue after 2 years just recently) but after using the Sirio 5000 for 6 months I would choose the Sirio over the Wilson 5000 any day of the week.

The Sirio magnet system is plenty capable of handling the antenna and it stays on at 85+ and the only time it's been knocked over is a low branch that caught it about 6" up from the base which would have knocked my Wilson over. The Wilson probably is less likely to be knocked over by branches and such but the Sirio magnet is plenty capable.

I better save something for the review

 

[skipshooter205]

just somthing to throw at you guys i run a wilson 5000 mag in my pickup but changed the wip out with a 10k i have not done a lot of testing between the 2 but it does knock down some of the noise swr's not the best with either wip
i think better with the 10k wip but not much i did no cutting factory lenghts
so i may get better results by cutting it down ?
i think the recieve is a little better with the 10k wip as well

 

[70cst]

Here is an update after 6 months of use.

I run a Stryker 447 with a TS 350HD.

The Siro seems to consistently match better than the 5000 on set up.

It just seems to me that I can pick up a better distance from the Siro than the 5000. Again just my opinion.

The Siro Mag mount seems a little week as I have hit some branches at low speeds and it knocked my antenna down. It has only happened a couple times but still...

After 6 months of use I still favor the Siro over the 5000 and as of now the Siro is my Antenna of choice.

 

[W5LZ]

Just for grins.

The typical mobile antenna has little to no ability to 'control' 'noise'. It has no idea what the difference is between the desired signal and an undesired signal (noise) so it supplies both to your radio. If a particular antenna seems to be 'noisier' than another the most likely cause is mechanical, not electrical in nature (something just isn't as 'tight' as it should be, rattling maybe?).
Believe it or not, a wide SWR range is not the sign of a really good antenna. The wider that SWR range the less efficient the antenna is. The extreme example of that is a dummy load, right? Good SWR from daylight to dark, but a really terrible antenna. So what's the difference between a dummy load and an antenna? The antenna will always have some reactance present in it which a good dummy load will not. The more reactance the greater the chances of a 'simple' SWR meter reading a good SWR. The right amount of the right kind of reactance in the right places can certainly be a good thing. But not in an antenna when you are talking about efficiency (how well the thing works/radiates), that's when you don't want any if you can possibly help it (which is also the definition of resonance, BTW). So what's the big deal with reactance? Reactance doesn't radiate or contribute to radiation in an antenna, it's always a loss. Not a very happy thought, huh? Sorry 'bout that, but that's how it is...
- 'Doc

 

[Mudfoot]

Sorry for the delay - been job hunting and also had the holidays take up a lot of time. Planning on finishing it next week.

Aside from the short coax run it comes with it easily beats the Wilson 5000 in terms of performance. I'll have more info and pictures when I finish the review.

I'd like to hear your impression on how you think the weather seal would hold up on a roof mount scenario. I believe you have the magnet mount, but the rubber seal is the same, I believe.

I roof mounted the Sirio on my Cherokee, but quickly reverted back to the Wilson 1000. The roof panel was to flimsy and I wasn't motivated to reinforce it, so I sold the Sirio. However, I recall that it looked prone to allow water to leak under the mount. Maybe not, it was just a quick observation. The Wilson roof mount gasket is righteous and dependable.

The Sirio is a stout design...

 

[The Mad Scientist]

"The coax on the sirio mag can be easyily changed to a better grade. I changed the coax on the one I use to the LMR200 ultraflex and used the formula to come up with the correct length for the band I am using. It works very well."

It sounds like you are saying that the feed line is being used for impedance matching, is that right? No idea what formula you would need if that isn't the case.
- 'Doc

Yes. That is correct.

 

[The Mad Scientist]

What formula are you talking about?

If you replaced 50Ω coax with 50Ω coax, and the original 50Ω coax was not used for matching purposes on a feedline with another impedance, any length would work.

Every mobile CB antenna I have ever seen only used 50Ω coax.

Also, I have on multiple occasions replaced the feedline on both Wilson 1000's and 5000's. I've used RG-8/x, RG-213, and LMR-400. I had to drill out the hole the feedline entered through, but aside from that have never had an issue. I typically used an electrical ½λ for tuning purposes, but any other length used in mobile applications would work just as well.


The DB

I am refering to the formula for inpaedance matching. I did this not to rectify any problems but rather to reflect the true swr at the antenna's feed point.

 

[The Mad Scientist]

Just for grins.

The typical mobile antenna has little to no ability to 'control' 'noise'. It has no idea what the difference is between the desired signal and an undesired signal (noise) so it supplies both to your radio. If a particular antenna seems to be 'noisier' than another the most likely cause is mechanical, not electrical in nature (something just isn't as 'tight' as it should be, rattling maybe?).
Believe it or not, a wide SWR range is not the sign of a really good antenna. The wider that SWR range the less efficient the antenna is. The extreme example of that is a dummy load, right? Good SWR from daylight to dark, but a really terrible antenna. So what's the difference between a dummy load and an antenna? The antenna will always have some reactance present in it which a good dummy load will not. The more reactance the greater the chances of a 'simple' SWR meter reading a good SWR. The right amount of the right kind of reactance in the right places can certainly be a good thing. But not in an antenna when you are talking about efficiency (how well the thing works/radiates), that's when you don't want any if you can possibly help it (which is also the definition of resonance, BTW). So what's the big deal with reactance? Reactance doesn't radiate or contribute to radiation in an antenna, it's always a loss. Not a very happy thought, huh? Sorry 'bout that, but that's how it is...
- 'Doc

Very good read there Doc. Which reminds me that the next time you come across an unlruly Wilson 5000 that will not tune up propperly take your trusty mfg 259b to it and see the reason that these antennas are the way they are.

They are suffering from a reactance issue for whatever reason. Most likey due to their obviously faulty quality control when barjan had the company.

 

[The DB]

What formula are you talking about?

If you replaced 50Ω coax with 50Ω coax, and the original 50Ω coax was not used for matching purposes on a feedline with another impedance, any length would work.

Every mobile CB antenna I have ever seen only used 50Ω coax.

Also, I have on multiple occasions replaced the feedline on both Wilson 1000's and 5000's. I've used RG-8/x, RG-213, and LMR-400. I had to drill out the hole the feedline entered through, but aside from that have never had an issue. I typically used an electrical ½λ for tuning purposes, but any other length used in mobile applications would work just as well.


The DB

I am refering to the formula for inpaedance matching. I did this not to rectify any problems but rather to reflect the true swr at the antenna's feed point.

Ahh ok, you did it for tuning purposes as well. It sounded to me like you said the coax was being used as part of a matching network for the antnna. Just misunderstood what ya said.


The DB

 

[The Mad Scientist]

I'd like to hear your impression on how you think the weather seal would hold up on a roof mount scenario. I believe you have the magnet mount, but the rubber seal is the same, I believe.

I roof mounted the Sirio on my Cherokee, but quickly reverted back to the Wilson 1000. The roof panel was to flimsy and I wasn't motivated to reinforce it, so I sold the Sirio. However, I recall that it looked prone to allow water to leak under the mount. Maybe not, it was just a quick observation. The Wilson roof mount gasket is righteous and dependable.

The Sirio is a stout design...

You would have to reinforce any of the larger antennas on these vehicles made today due to the cheap flimsy sheet metal that is used. But I never hear of any of those antennas being canned for that reason.....reinforcemnet of the mounting area should go without saying. the fault lies with the vehicle and not with the antenna.

There is a water intrusion issue that I have seen, and I am not sure if it is with all of the antennas or just the one I have. I addressed this water intrusion issue in one of my threads I posed here. The water intrusion is not comming from the seal, but rather seeping down between the outer plastic housing and the base metal insert. the outer plastic housing on the base is just press fitted over the base itself. The plastic cover over the base sould have been fitted with an "o" ring to keep the water from seeping into the base. Now this is with the turbo 5000 series and I am not sure if it is the same with the p5000 or not. I personally do not see a problem with the roof seal that it comes with, although if the look of it bothers some people this too can be remidied.

There is another issue with the turbo model.....That is that the antenna's lay down feature is accomplished by unscrewing the coil part of the antenna and folding it over. It is held in place by the screw down tension. Which only needs a moderate tap from an overhead object to knock it crooked. I have since rectified this issue as well as I don't use the lay down feature. Because of this issue I recommend the p5000 model over the turbo version. But the issues I have seen and corrected do not outweigh the use of the antenna.

It would seem that every commercialy made antenna is going to have an issue or two. Having disected both the wilson and the sirio antennas they both have pros and cons.

Being an avid Wilson user for so many years it was a real downer what has happened to them when bargan took over the company. I have been in direct contact with D.A.S. the new owners of the Wilson line and gone over all of the appearent problems with them and was assured that they would be addrressed. Only time will tell. This too was posted in one of my threads here.

As far as the sirio goes for what it is, and myslef not being one of those "particular people" I decided to work with it and see what panned out. And it appears to work better for me than any of the Wilsons ever did. Now having said this there is something that people need to remember when working with antennas:

RF is unpredictable and what will work in one setup will not work in another.

I have seen many different people install these sirio antennas and have all kind of results under the sun. And one of the main things that goes overlooked is the bonding (grounding) of the vehicle. I myself have done extensive grounding of my full size truck long ago. There are to many potential problems to list here if the vehicle is not propperly grounded. I had used more then 50 feet of 5/8" tinned braided ground strap and grounded the entire vehicle. And despite what others may THINK, In my experence the bonding of the vehicle does make a difference weather the antenna is hard mounted or NOT.

The two main differences I have found between the two antennas is the electrical length and how the antennas are matched. the electrical length of the sirio is around 108" and the wilson 5000 is around 101 and change. Someone once asked we "how do you know that" well I have physically measured them.

The other is it would appear that the sirio is inductively matched while the Wilson is not. If you have Questions about this please refer to my before mentioned threads that I have posted here on the subject.

Oh, and I almost forgot. To base an antenna purly on astetics is rediculious. That crowd that just wants an antenna to look good should stay with astectics without planning on operation.

The sirio antennas and the OLDER Wilsons antennas are very good. the whole issue in the comparisn lies with the newer barjan made wilson antennas. If the Wilson 5000 I had was of the same quality I would have kept it.


I too look foward to your review as I hope it contains some technical aspects.

I wish everyone a Happy new year!

 

[The Mad Scientist]

Ahh ok, you did it for tuning purposes as well. It sounded to me like you said the coax was being used as part of a matching network for the antnna. Just misunderstood what ya said.


The DB

No problem. Just wanted to make sure that I was getting the correct swr at the antennas feedpoint.