OUTRAGEOUS!

[paws264]

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Now this is Bull Sh*t

Now, there are people calling themselves "Techs" performing modifications and so-called, "Peak and Tune" jobs on this forum who openly admit to taking out factory installed features on radios that they "fix".

I am talking about the "Top-Gun" features in the Magnum radios.

I spent 20+ years doing field service for companies such as Xerox, Eastman Kodak, and, IBM; I maintained leased and sold equipment in office environments. You can best DARN well believe that when you serviced a piece of equipment you did not "field-retrofit (pull out)" a part out because you did not like the way it operated; if it came out of the factory with it then, you restored it to specifications.

If there was even one extra screw or nut left after you got finished, there was a problem!

Back to radio; when I repair or modify ANYTHING I attempt to do so in such a way that it:

1. DOES NOT CHANGE THE APPEARANCE OF THE DEVICE

2. DOES NOT REMOVE ANY FEATURES THE OWNER PAID FOR.

3. DOES NOT LESSEN RESALE VALUE.


So, you might be wondering why I am on a rant like this well, this is why:

Smart Ass pulls it out of your radio and sells it to somebody else.

This is outrageous; right now, there are complaints about repair individuals who are sinking so low as to take parts from one amplifier to fix another and then charge both owners for the price if the part.

I would suspect that the same thing is happening with these "Top Gun" features that are being snatched out of radios without the owners prior authorization.

Oh, BTW, any time I replace a part, I save the bad part for the owner; any "Top Gun" modules taken out of any radio still belongs to the owner of the radio, yes?

.

 

[Moleculo]

Paws, I think comparing factory designed and well engineered office equipment from Eastman Kodak and IBM to an export radio that isn't even legal and has lame documented design issues is a little non-sequitor. People send in radios to techs for modification to overcome or bypass design issues or other imposed limitations, or to make the radio do something it wasn't designed to do. People don't call the copier repair guy for the same thing.

The fact that Magnum adds artificial NPC/RC (diode/resistor) to cb and charges extra for the new models calling it a "new feature" to the point where people feel the radio is devalued without it is pretty pathetic.

Personally, I don't understand why people are all excited about why a tech decides to toss a component he determines is not needed. For years, everyone was perfectly OK with them yanking out ALC circuitry or AMC diodes and tossing them in the trash. But if you put a diode and a resistor on a board it must be something special that is sacred.

Maybe all that is needed is a little better communication up front, or a little closer attention paid to what a tech says he does with that model of radio. At any rate, it is pretty pathetic that this guy is selling the boards on ebay. But hey, one's man garbage is another's treasure....

 

[bcrewcaptain]

.

Now this is Bull Sh*t

Now, there are people calling themselves "Techs" performing modifications and so-called, "Peak and Tune" jobs on this forum who openly admit to taking out factory installed features on radios that they "fix".

I am talking about the "Top-Gun" features in the Magnum radios.

I spent 20+ years doing field service for companies such as Xerox, Eastman Kodak, and, IBM; I maintained leased and sold equipment in office environments. You can best DARN well believe that when you serviced a piece of equipment you did not "field-retrofit (pull out)" a part out because you did not like the way it operated; if it came out of the factory with it then, you restored it to specifications.

If there was even one extra screw or nut left after you got finished, there was a problem!

Back to radio; when I repair or modify ANYTHING I attempt to do so in such a way that it:

1. DOES NOT CHANGE THE APPEARANCE OF THE DEVICE

2. DOES NOT REMOVE ANY FEATURES THE OWNER PAID FOR.

3. DOES NOT LESSEN RESALE VALUE.


So, you might be wondering why I am on a rant like this well, this is why:

Smart Ass pulls it out of your radio and sells it to somebody else.

This is outrageous; right now, there are complaints about repair individuals who are sinking so low as to take parts from one amplifier to fix another and then charge both owners for the price if the part.

I would suspect that the same thing is happening with these "Top Gun" features that are being snatched out of radios without the owners prior authorization.

Oh, BTW, any time I replace a part, I save the bad part for the owner; any "Top Gun" modules taken out of any radio still belongs to the owner of the radio, yes?

.

the point you forget to bring up is what you are doing is "warranty/service" work designed to bring a certain product to normal operatings specs
The silly discussion is about doing "not quite legal" work on a cb radio. There have been NO complaints about the radio or the way it performs in the least. Its no secret what the certain tech DOES to a radio, and if there were any questions about said radio mod then they should have been asked. Its not up to the tech to explain exactly WHAT is done but for the customer to ask before the sale, not complain after the fact.
You're not asking for a simple freq alignment its a PEAK AND TUNE, and if the circuits in the radio are designed in a manner they hinder the overall tune, I would expect they be removed.
Does every tech explain in advance they will use a nb switch for extra channels?dimmer becomes a var power?
better yet...how many techs explain the're gonna pull the ALC or crank all the pots wide open?
Hindsight is 20/20.
Maybe people will know now to ask questions...

 

[paws264]

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Let me make sure that we are talking about the same thing here:

1. I am not comparing a $27K High-speed duplicator to a $270.00 Radio.

2. I am not talking about the CUSTOMER who buys a radio and pays extra for speech processors or whatever.

3. Under no circumstance is "lifting the leg of TR 32" the same as pulling sealed "modules" out of radios.

Let somebody pull the AM filter out of your Yaesu FT-101 'cause you don't need it, or maybe switch your 128 meg video card for a 8 meg.

I am talking about the professionalism of the "Tech" and the fact that they have no right to take something "RE-SALEABLE" out and not return it to the owner, it is called "Theft By Conversion"

When an individual has lawfully obtained the property of another for a specified use, and he instead converts the property for own use in violation of the agreement, it is called theft by conversion.

Excuse me but, the fact about being "The Xerox Man" is this, there was integrity in the work that you performed; "Joe Xerox" was there 6 months ago and he fixed the machine to spec, "Bill Xerox" cames in today and he fixes it and puts it back to spec so that 6 months from now, if "Jim Xerox" has to come in, he will not find some "Gringo-rigged" modification that he cannot support. Does that make sense?

And, let me add this "Joe Xerox" communicated what was wrong with the equipment, what he did to fix it, showed them the bad parts/fixed machine and gain the customer's acceptance before leaving.

The radio "Techs" need to be more like "Joe Xerox" and less like "Joe Camel".



.

 

[bcrewcaptain]

When an individual has lawfully obtained the property of another for a specified use, and he instead converts the property for own use in violation of the agreement, it is called theft by conversion.



I guess I dont understand what this is supposed to mean? Are you indicating that the tech in questions is removing parts just to resell?If so I find that to be a pretty bold statement unless you have some damn good proof

 

[paws264]

When an individual has lawfully obtained the property of another for a specified use, and he instead converts the property for own use in violation of the agreement, it is called theft by conversion.



I guess I dont understand what this is supposed to mean?

The Law is pretty clear

Are you indicating that the tech in questions is removing parts just to resell?

I never said the "Tech in question" was "JUST DOING ANYTHING", don't try to put words in my mouth or blame me for your mis-interpretations (and if he wasn't pulling them out and throwing them in the garbage can(?) then there would not be any questions would there.

If so I find that to be a pretty bold statement unless you have some damn good proof

I am here talking about the practices of "Teks" who take advantage of their customers. I have no "Dogs in this fight" and I am only speaking out for the customers and against the practice of snatching modules out of equipment and not giving them back to the rightful owner.

I am on the side of "Right", the opposite side of this argument is "Wrong", which side are you on?

And, beyond all of that, why are you personally raising the level of this post to the level of DEMANDING "FOUR-LETTER-WORD PROOF" when there are no accusations just questions?

Can he "PROVE" that he threw them in the garbage can; will he continue (in light of the fact that they have resale value on eBay) to throw them in the can?

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[AudioShockwav]

Can he "PROVE" that he threw them in the garbage can; will he continue (in light of the fact that they have resale value on eBay) to throw them in the can?

Can you prove that he did not?


Too funny Paws..
Were is the little guy stiring the pot?
I think You are such a noble-minded gentleman to stand up for all the little guys, Right on dude.

:bounce :bounce :bounce

73
Jeff

 

[theradioroom]

I see alot of garbage mods come into the shop from day to day. When I pull out a mod, there is a reason for it. I try to make the radio sound the best it can without removing parts from it. The parts are there for a reason. Cutting modulation diode in a radio to "open up" the modulation makes it unstable. There is no way to control the modulation on the radio anymore. I get customers all the time who want more mod, but when they try to turn up the mic gain, it squeals, feedback or sounds like s**t. Modifying the circut to perform better is the way to go. I do it every day. I don't pull parts out of one radio to sell to another person. If I pull them, they don't need to be in the radio in the first place so why would I put them in another radio? I'm sure there are shops out there that do this, but the great majority don't. Bottom line, If your going to take your radio to a shop, check them out first. Make sure that they haven't done bad work for someone else. Ask questions when your there. Try to make the tech explain to you why he is doing what he is doing. A good tech can explain to anyone why he is doing a mod. Don't want to get screwed? Open your mouth and participate in the repair or mod of your radio.

 

[C2]

Yes, I think I've seen that before.

Thats new?

 

[bcrewcaptain]

When an individual has lawfully obtained the property of another for a specified use, and he instead converts the property for own use in violation of the agreement, it is called theft by conversion.



I guess I dont understand what this is supposed to mean?

The Law is pretty clear

I'm pretty sure we are NOT discussing a radio that meets the "legal" 4w limit....so as far as I can see at least...the "letter" of the law does not really hold too much water here bud.

Are you indicating that the tech in questions is removing parts just to resell?

I never said the "Tech in question" was "JUST DOING ANYTHING", don't try to put words in my mouth or blame me for your mis-interpretations (and if he wasn't pulling them out and throwing them in the garbage can(?) then there would not be any questions would there.

I'm pretty sure by the way it was phrased that you dont seem to think a person could remove a part and just throw it away.....I would think that if a tech though enough they would remove it from a radio they were tuning for a paying customer that they are more than likely NOT going to reuse it somewhere else, I'm sure there are some that will...but hey....not gonna make that a blanket statement...

If so I find that to be a pretty bold statement unless you have some damn good proof

I am here talking about the practices of "Teks" who take advantage of their customers. I have no "Dogs in this fight" and I am only speaking out for the customers and against the practice of snatching modules out of equipment and not giving them back to the rightful owner.

I guess you're right...if the customer so requested the said parts would be returned to the customer....does that mean it makes it all better if someone gets a hack tune that as long as the ALC circuit is taped to the top of the case when they get it back its ok?

I am on the side of "Right", the opposite side of this argument is "Wrong", which side are you on?

I'm on the side of anyone who can tune a radio and NOT screw you in the deal....I personally have had several radios tuned by the tech in question...have I even popped the cover to see what was done?NO..do I care?NO...I got back a loud radio, right on freq and far exceeding expectations, I'm not a tech, I dont pretend to be, HOWEVER, when I send ANYTHING off to have any work done to it I would expect that the person doing said work will do anything I ask, I'm the the money and I'm the one that needs to be pleased as part of a good interaction.
If I have something pulled out that I didnt want to....I would hold myself responsible for not asking the questions in advance

And, beyond all of that, why are you personally raising the level of this post to the level of DEMANDING "FOUR-LETTER-WORD PROOF" when there are no accusations just questions?

Can he "PROVE" that he threw them in the garbage can; will he continue (in light of the fact that they have resale value on eBay) to throw them in the can?

Paws, I'm not trying to slam you in any way, you have proven before in your posts you have far more knowledge about the workings of radios and such than I do, but there is a good chance I have a bit more experience in customer service and knowing what it takes to make a customer happy...I also know if you don't ask the right questions...it falls back on you....

.

 

[Moleculo]

When an individual has lawfully obtained the property of another for a specified use, and he instead converts the property for own use in violation of the agreement, it is called theft by conversion.

I'm not a lawyer, do have quite a bit of experience with contracts and binding agreements. In just reading that, it doesn't sound like it applies except under certain circumstances. If you're talking about a tech who steals necessary components for the purposes of reselling them then that law may apply.

However, if the "agreement" was to adjust the radio's circuitry to overcome or change the radio design for some purpose with little or no guidance, limitations, or exclusions given, then the "agreement" is left open to the tech's judgement by default. In such circumstance where the radio actually performs as requested per the "agreement" and returned to the rightful owner, then the property was not converted for the tech's own use.

I still don't see how the examples of the business machine tech apply. One person is paid to return a machine to spec. Another person is paid to take a device out of spec. I suppose next you'll want to take the hot-rod mechanic to task because he replaced the stock exhaust as asked and then sold the stock parts when the customer didn't ask for it back?

Again, it all seems a bit non-sequitor.

 

[paws264]

Nope, mine is bigger than yours when it comes to Customer service!

20+ years of with the Fortune 500 companies, Food Service/Hospitality Manager for 2 local Pro Sports teams for 5 years and 25 years in this CB business (out of my Garage) the last 10 with my own shop (now closed) plus THIS.

I learned the "Customer Service" lessons from the best teachers in the world, they were all ex military guys (every manager I ever worked for was ex military) and the Xerox Corp was the industry benchmark for Sales and field service support.

I learned the hard way, by making all the bad mistakes first; ouch it hurt. I became very good at managing people, territories and, finally companies and organizations,

But who really gives a crap about that???

Old tubes, transistors, blown lamps, "Top Gun modules" and, etc all belong to the customer, when you give him is radio back, you give him a bag of parts you took out; if he says "Trash 'em" then you are home free.

More with tube equipment, there were repair guys who would take the modulation transformers out of some radios and lash then up so that they would still talk, turned some Trams into worthless junk.

There is a "Big Tube" builder who has recently gotten a bad Rep for taking from "Peter" to re-build "Paul". He will take the good parts out of one amp to get a Pay-day on another one and then charge the first guy to replace his own good part in addition to any other parts needed.

Customer's shouldn't have to feel like they are dealing with a "Used Car Salemen" when they take their radio to the shop..


.

 

[paws264]

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The Auto mechanic has you check off a box as to whether you want a written estimate AND do you want your bad parts returned (in Ohio).

My mistake for setting my expectation too high, I understand that there are different level of integrity mostly based on your clientelle and the value of the equipment that you service.

Certainly CB'er don't deserve treated fairly and honestly by other CB'ers-"Teks", they certainly don't deserve the consideration that the office manager on the 55th floor gets.

Because their CB radios don't cost as much as Quality Amateur equipment it's OK to hack it up.

And, always remember, if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with Bullsh*t, and last but not least, "Screw 'em if that cannot take a joke and Joke them if they can't take being screwed".

Just like buying a used car.

.

 

[paws264]

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Watch This: Hey guys, 'dem 'ol Top Gunn things ain't no count, go tell your local "Tek" to rip them out of your radio and send them to me, I'll give you a nickle for them AND pay the shipping.

Now, let's just see how many "Top Gun" modules I get sent to me in the next month here.

.

PS: Jeff, I'm serious on this subject, no pot-stirring here.

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[CHARLEYMARBLES]

Hey paws take a breath man I can see you'r point but you are reading way further into this than you need to,most cb'ers take their stuff to the tech to get i "MODDED" to get more performance outta it. Now if you asked the tech to restore the radio to stock that is different,but i never heard of someone takeing a radio to a tech for that. I am a diesel freak and let me tell you there is not a diesel engine out there that I would run "stock" from the factory they just don't put the r&d into them before they ship them out,same for radios, for the most part they get it to run and do he R&D on the public. Not the way i would do it but thats the reality of it in our degraded world. SAD BUT TRUE!! I haven't had the privlige yet of working with the "tech in question" butt I do look forward to it when my finances afford me the oppertunity and if he say's hey Chuck you know you can get more outta this if you do this guess what? I'm gonna say goferit cause that's what I'm paying him for If i knew all the stuff i wouldn't be saving my pennys to send it to him. JUST MY TWO CHUNKS OF COPPER


Chuck